This is a discussion on TNA IS reprehensible within the TNA Discussion forums, part of the Wrestling Forums category; Originally Posted by Tommy Platinum
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Once again, big difference between wrestling and getting thrown on tacks. Even men getting thrown on tacks is outdated, but TNA are just trying to recreate the Attitude Era. Things like that probably should have died out in wrestling, nevermind done to women.
Again, stop bringing up that she agreed to do it or was happy to do it because thats irrelevant, its just a terrible way to try to make the product interesting by having women brutalize each other.
Yes its something new, but its also shit.
Give me a break. Point is women are trained to take spots like men. Thats what they do in developmental. I agree TNA had gone overboard with gimmick matches. However, you once told me that blading added something to a match. Violent gimmick matches add something to Daffney's character. Raven wouldnt be Raven if he had nothing but normal matches throughout his career, and the same goes for Daffney. You have complained several times about women in wrestling having zero character. If TNA is to created a sick & twisted female character, then they have to put her in violent spots. Daffney was trained to take the spot, and the spot with done with another female, in a hardcore gimmick match. There is nothing wrong with this.
CZW is also something different but its still terrible and a joke of a company. The argument that "its different so it must be good" just doesn't work in my opinion.
Okay, I stopped reading after that because I never said it was good just because it was different. You're not even arguing on topic anymore. Lol.
On a side note, I dislike the X Division. I think that is a great example of what Steve said: TNA not understanding wrestling so instead just throwing together a load of random moves and spots with no care for psychology, just to get the fans to chant.
On this note, watch the X Division King of the Mountain match and you'll see why the X Division still has some heart. It was a fun and exciting match. It kept you guessing who was going to win and the spots they did were innovative and not just eye candy. Of course in that type of match their isn't a whole lot you can do, but they did a good job at keeping most of the wrestlers in the match involved.
TNA just doesn't give you one dimension. Neither does CZW, believe it or not they actually have matches that don't involve glass, barbed wire, or tables. CZW has a very ECW based approach to wrestling, or use to. They've had a fair amount of good wrestlers in the ring. Although this argument isn't about CZW. Sometimes you just have to look past the cheesy parts of TNA to get to something that is entertaining. I mean, I thought the Mick Foley and JB thing was hilarious and classic. But at the same time I thought the beginning having them welcome Jeff Jarrett back was just Mick trying to recreate a WWE moment.
I'm not disagreeing with you or agreeing with you. I'm simply expressing my point of TNA not doing everything wrong. Sure maybe Daffney in tacks wasn't the best thing to show. It certainly doesn't represent true wrestling. But it is something I've never seen before beside on Ian Rotten's watch. TNA is exposing fans to stuff in wrestling that is still out there. They make plenty of mistakes, but who cares. It is something different. Us whining and complaining isn't going to change the product. So just take it for what it is worth.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CM Punk
"I'm harder than any alcohol you can drink. I'm straighter than any line you can snort up your nose. And I certainly can hurt you a lot faster than any pill you put on your tongue."
Let's be fair Tom, you've probably seen two CZW matches ever, and never seen an entire show, so really you can stop slating them already....
As for the topic, I see no problem with what they did. A heel getting her just deserts, it seems fair and fitting. Like nex, I see no reason why women can't do it. I've seen women do deathmatches and do them well. If it had been something like Abyss (or whoever the heel is in the fued) throwing someone like Taylor Wilde into tacks just to get them over, fair enough. Even then, it's not much of a big deal. Jimmy Jacobs spikey Daizee Haze in the head as a heel move (i.e. you are meant to hate him for hitting a women, which is fair).
The "different for the sake of it" arguement is retarded, but without seeing the match I don't see the problem here (apart from the fact the match and fued sounds awful, but thats a given).
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She is a wrestler. So is Abyss and Raven. Its Monsters Ball. Its meant to be harcore. She would have been fine and probably asked to do it. Why can she not take a tack bump but Doctor Stevie can?
Reprehensible would be threatning her job for the spot, which did not happen. Your really really over reacting.
__________________ Originally posted by Tommy Platinum "Silver Saviour is great. He is one of my favourate posters, he's a ledge and a cool guy 2"
Let's be fair Tom, you've probably seen two CZW matches ever, and never seen an entire show, so really you can stop slating them already....
I'm not saying its all like what I've seen, even if its coming across that way. What I'm saying is that the hardcore shit I've seen is bad enough for me to say that its a reprehensible promotion, even if that isn't the entire product.
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I believe your failed point was that women shouldnt be taking those kind of bumps for a cheap "TNA TNA TNA" pop. If not, just tell us in plain English.
I believe your failed point was that women shouldnt be taking those kind of bumps for a cheap "TNA TNA TNA" pop. If not, just tell us in plain English.
Pretty much, although the Daffney thing was just a good example of TNA being a bit too over the top with hardcore stuff in general.
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I agree, especially when it's used so much and usually without any reason. I don't think most of us want to see Daffney and Taylor Wilde rolling around in tacks, but if they're agreeing to it, I see no problem with it. You just presented and worded yourself wrong.
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I'll agree that TNA use hardcore (and gimmicks in general) far too much, but to call them reprehensible simply for having Daffney take a tack bump is mis-guided in my opinion. Especially with your wording of it.
Daffney took the bump of Taylor and she took it well, it played perfectly into the psychology of the match (which I'll admit is somewhat of a stretch, but is still relevent) and the fact that you're complaining about it without watching it nullifies you point mate. You haven't seen it, so can't say that it didn't bring something to the match, and therefore cannot call it reprehensible. The storyline and Daffney's gimmick meant this was always a possibility for her, and watching it it did nothing but make the match more impactful and provide an entertaining finish to an entertaining brawl.
It's sexist and vaguely insulting to say that women shouldn't be taking these bumps. If they want to do it, let them. Roxxi was hard-wayed when he head was shaved, but afterwards did blade... Her response to questions about that in interviews was that it added to her character and her matches and that she was more than happy to do it. The women are trained exactly the same way the guys are, so why can't they taking these bumps?
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