View Poll Results: HITMAN vs STONE COLD

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  • Bret Hart

    15 75.00%
  • Steve Austin

    5 25.00%
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Thread: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

  1. #1
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    ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin




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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    This would’ve been a good match.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dakstang
    You can't have a reasonable discussion about serious topics with people like Marketh around.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    I'm going Bret here. Absolute shocker, I know. I think Bret got more out of less talented workers and that was ultimately the deciding factor for me. I don't think there's a great deal between them because they're both quality wrestlers, but I don't think there's enough examples of Austin carrying multiple Kevin Nash-tier wrestlers to great matches to vote him over Bret.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Quote Originally Posted by Shock View Post
    I'm going Bret here. Absolute shocker, I know. I think Bret got more out of less talented workers and that was ultimately the deciding factor for me. I don't think there's a great deal between them because they're both quality wrestlers, but I don't think there's enough examples of Austin carrying multiple Kevin Nash-tier wrestlers to great matches to vote him over Bret.
    Pretty much exactly my reasoning. Austin had plenty of great matches, a lot of which ranks up there as being some of the very best in multiple wrestler's careers. Off the top of my head though, I can't think of a single weak opponent that Austin truly carried. The closest example would be Mr. McMahon, I've never said that their St. Valentine's Day Massacre match is anything more than just fun and it's not even Vinnie Mac's best match. The very best example of Austin as a worker will forever be against Savio Vega, but one match is not enough to compare to Bret carrying countless men over the years.

    Austin's strength came from being an all around wrestler who particularly excelled with wild brawls, promo skills, and a super popular personality. He wasn't a worker though. In a tournament built around the best worker, Bret will always beat Austin.

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    Mr. Victory Through Guts

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Also to be fair Savio was a good worker, just not a star.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Going with Austin but it's very close.

    - Bret took longer to get good than Austin did
    - Late career WCW Bret ranges from completely mailing it in to "decent" at best
    - Hart Foundation are VERY hit and miss for me
    - I am a low-voter on the DBS matches
    - I like the Nash matches but don't think they're five star classics or anything close
    - There are some of his big fueds where he faced the opponent multiple times but I only liked one of the matches - Perfect, Backlund, DBS again
    - People rightly point to the carryjobs against pre-Kane or Nash, but wasn't able to carry ANYBODY. Off head matches with Patriot, Bigelow, Sid and a couple others weren't anything memorable. Not that I think Austin could carry anyone, but Bret's biggest plus was his ability to play to his opponent's strengths, so worth noting even on that there was a limit to his ability.


    I'd take early career Austin and the Dangerous Alliance stuff over early career Bret; Hollywood Blondes were around for a shorter period but more consistently good than the HF; big singles runs are a pick-ems but I'd take 2001 Austin over '97 Bret (or whatever Bret's best year was). It's not much a point worth talking but I will say Austin taking his ball and going home ended his career on a better note than Bret going to the opposition and visibly not caring for a couple years.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    For whatever its worth I'd take demotivated Bret from 1998-1999 over demotivated Austin from the first half of 2002. Nobody was getting good matches out of Austin whereas Bret had at least a couple of noteworthy WCW matches.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Hey that Patriot/Bret feud match was good and the tag team flag match that follows in October was really good.

  9. #9

    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    I loved Bret's matches with Bigelow. Although not as good as the Shawn Survivor Series match, I quite dug Bret/Sid from IYH It's Time. No problem with calling that Sid's second best WWE match.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Quote Originally Posted by Zero View Post
    Hey that Patriot/Bret feud match was good and the tag team flag match that follows in October was really good.
    Isn’t it obvious that he just isn’t a Bret Hart guy and would therefore come up with any reason not to vote for him?


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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Quote Originally Posted by Shock View Post
    For whatever its worth I'd take demotivated Bret from 1998-1999 over demotivated Austin from the first half of 2002. Nobody was getting good matches out of Austin whereas Bret had at least a couple of noteworthy WCW matches.

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    I thought the Jericho vs Austin match was really good considering how bad the booking was. Horses for courses though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zero View Post
    Hey that Patriot/Bret feud match was good and the tag team flag match that follows in October was really good.
    It was fine. Wouldn't say either match was particularly noteworthy, but we'll disagree.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Quote Originally Posted by Fuji Vice View Post
    Isn’t it obvious that he just isn’t a Bret Hart guy and would therefore come up with any reason not to vote for him?


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    Ha, I'm not coming across as it - but I am a big fan of Bret and think he was a great worker. He's had a run in this tournament against 3 of my all-time favourites though and I will put my reasons out there. Would rate him over a lot of others who have had an easier run.

    This was a super close one for me. I'm not voting Austin because Bret didn't have a great match with Patriot, but the point fed into my overall opinion Bret wasn't a guy who could carry anyone at anytime to a great match. I don't think that's too outrageous of an idea.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Quote Originally Posted by King Steventon View Post
    Ha, I'm not coming across as it - but I am a big fan of Bret and think he was a great worker. He's had a run in this tournament against 3 of my all-time favourites though and I will put my reasons out there. Would rate him over a lot of others who have had an easier run.

    This was a super close one for me. I'm not voting Austin because Bret didn't have a great match with Patriot, but the point fed into my overall opinion Bret wasn't a guy who could carry anyone at anytime to a great match. I don't think that's too outrageous of an idea.
    Not too outrageous, but the same could be said for Austin, no? Or a lot of other guys in the tournament.

    I don’t have the time to put a list together at the moment, but often, the measuring stick for wrestlers is how many guys had their best match with them. Excusing their obvious pairing with each other, how many would Austin be able to lay claim to in comparison to Hart?


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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    I think the final years point is a rather insignificant one because both were embarrassments to their career at that point. Austin from 2001 to 2002 is a monumental drop in quality and effort. So is Bret from 1997 to the rest of his career. Austin ends on a very good match to retire on but that's one night in the last couple of years of his career.

    Also Steve, you bring up times where Bret didn't produce in carryjobs, but isn't that a sign of the roster at the time of mid 90s WWF that Bret's peak came around the time WWE had a weak roster? He's not going to produce magic every night. Is Stone Cold going to have great carryjob matches with Sid and Kane and Patriot and the like? Austin struggled to get anything watchable out of Undertaker so I don't rate his chances against those lads. Austin on the other hand gets his peak main event days when he's on a roster with Rock, Angle, Beniot, Jericho, Foley, Michaels, and of course Bret when he was just breaking through.

    That being said. I'm voting for Austin. Peak Austin to me is pro-wrestling at it's finest and I'm always going to prefer that to peak Bret. I think their matches together are them at their best, and then there's a drop off in quality in my mind when I watch Bret with other wrestlers, it's not as magical, whereas I can watch Austin with Rock at Wrestlemania 17 or Angle at Summerslam 2001 and still think I'm seeing Austin at his very best. I'd also agree that Austin's rookie days were more enjoyable than Bret's rookie days. That's not to say Bret doesn't have other great matches, but compared to Austin's other great matches they feel a bit exhibitiony and lacking that big fight feel - they feel really dated even though there's not that many years between them.
    Last edited by Ed; 05-22-2020 at 08:55 AM.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Totally agree I don't think Austin was the guy to carry shitty workers to something out of nothing. That's not the argument I'm going to make for Austin. I bring it up for Bret because, to me, that was Bret's biggest upside as a worker. For me, Austin's biggest upside was a bunch of other things - his personality, his offence, the physicality of his matches, his versatility from high end brawls to technical matches, working as a high-end babyface and a high-end heel.

  16. #16

    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed View Post
    I'd also agree that Austin's rookie days were more enjoyable than Bret's rookie days.
    Out of curiosity, what's the oldest Bret Hart match you've seen?

  17. #17
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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Quote Originally Posted by King Steventon View Post
    Totally agree I don't think Austin was the guy to carry shitty workers to something out of nothing. That's not the argument I'm going to make for Austin. I bring it up for Bret because, to me, that was Bret's biggest upside as a worker. For me, Austin's biggest upside was a bunch of other things - his personality, his offence, the physicality of his matches, his versatility from high end brawls to technical matches, working as a high-end babyface and a high-end heel.
    Minus the personality point, you literally just described Bret Hart. If it’s solely personality, it should have no bearing here.


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  18. #18

    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Quote Originally Posted by Fuji Vice View Post
    Minus the personality point, you literally just described Bret Hart. If it’s solely personality, it should have no bearing here.
    For sure. Bret knew how to mix it up depending on the opponent. Look at the Diesel matches where Bret wouldn't truly become a heel, but in order to get Diesel a babyface reaction, Hart became extra aggressive. Similar stuff would be done on a lesser scale years earlier when the babyface Hart Foundation would battle another babyface team like The Rockers.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Quote Originally Posted by Fuji Vice View Post
    Minus the personality point, you literally just described Bret Hart. If it’s solely personality, it should have no bearing here.


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    Personality as in in-ring personality not promo ability. I think Bret was really good at all of those things but Austin was better.

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    Re: ROUND 3: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin

    Quote Originally Posted by Shock View Post
    For whatever its worth I'd take demotivated Bret from 1998-1999 over demotivated Austin from the first half of 2002. Nobody was getting good matches out of Austin whereas Bret had at least a couple of noteworthy WCW matches.

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    Some people say that Austin's Backlash '02 match against Taker is still going on to this day.

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