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Thread: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

  1. #21
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    She was also one of top star of her era and way more influential than most other wrestlers. There is something to people considering her to be a GOAT Candidate 20 plus years after her prime.

    Chyna has accolades too - the Rumble, IC title win, etc. But it's quite below Toyota and a few others.

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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Looking Glass View Post
    I mean we can all pull the better wrestler card but you also inducted John Cena last year, so intuition tells me the basis for HOF isn't purely wrestling.....
    Sorry is it 2005 and we still think Cena isn't a great wrestler?



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  3. #23
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Silk View Post
    Sorry is it 2005 and we still think Cena isn't a great wrestler?
    Is he though?

    Personally, i find him a little above average. Sure hes pretty great if someone is with him like a Styles, Daniel, HBK or Zayn.

    Then again, from my memory of watching WWE religiously he was never that exciting or even interesting in ring. His STFU is ugly as sin. That was pretty much pre 2007.

    From 2006 on wards, i have only seen matches of his with guys like Styles, Owens, Punk, Zayn, Cesaro, Daniel. Those guys are awesome talents in ring and have a higher chance of getting a great match out of anyone.
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  4. #24

    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Silk View Post
    Sorry is it 2005 and we still think Cena isn't a great wrestler?
    Correct.

  5. #25

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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by indyfan View Post
    Is he though?

    Personally, i find him a little above average. Sure hes pretty great if someone is with him like a Styles, Daniel, HBK or Zayn.

    Then again, from my memory of watching WWE religiously he was never that exciting or even interesting in ring. His STFU is ugly as sin. That was pretty much pre 2007.

    From 2006 on wards, i have only seen matches of his with guys like Styles, Owens, Punk, Zayn, Cesaro, Daniel. Those guys are awesome talents in ring and have a higher chance of getting a great match out of anyone.
    I don't wanna get into the semantics of good, great, average, above average, decent, semi-capable, yada yada yada.

    Cena's resume is full of gems. We all know he had some stinkers, particularly in the early section of his career, but I really do think it's indisputable that he grew into a hell of a professional wrestler and great matches are great matches no matter who he had them with. Obviously the criteria for this Hall is much more than just wrestling ability, but he could have pulled several better examples out of past classes than Cena.



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  6. #26
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Cena is the biggest star of an entire decade, so he'd be a hall of famer even if he was Jenna Morasca in the ring

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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Cena has gotten entertaining matches with The fucking Great Khali. Man deserves to be in here for that alone.

    Cena I feel benefited from WWE's main roster signing more and more indie talent, but that certainly isn't a bad thing. When your pretty ,much tasked with facing a green Johnny Nitro, Carlito Mr Kennedy and mid-2000's Chris Masters, in hindsight I personally can overlook the fact his TV matches weren't the most captivating. Taking guys like Cesaro, Sami Zayn, The Shield, etc on on a regular basis clearly improved him as a performer and it isn't like he wasn't having great matches with Umaga & as mentioned, Great Khali before then. Hell, as played out and boring as the Orton feud got, their SummerSlam 2007 Match, I Quit Match and their Royal Rumble 2014 matches are all pretty great stuff imo.
    Last edited by Chaddes; 04-16-2020 at 03:33 PM.

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  8. #28
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Shock View Post
    Cena is the biggest star of an entire decade, so he'd be a hall of famer even if he was Jenna Morasca in the ring

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    That’s literally the point I making, whatever the example I used, doesn’t change the answer and the question was asked because the discussion was surrounding who was better in their ring and that weighing more than star power or cultural impact. I wasn’t hating on Cena when I made the comment or disregarding his success.

    Anyway, let’s move on with the actual discussion.
    Last edited by Looking Glass; 04-16-2020 at 03:33 PM.



  9. #29
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    I'm not in total disagreement about Cena in the ring. Eventually he rose in my opinion of him to being good, but not great. I've never sought out a match purely because he was in it.

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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    While on the subject of great Cena opponents, and considering I don't have the knowledge of Japanese or super old school wrestling to campaign for others, let it be known that I'm getting on my big CM Punk soapbox this year.



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  11. #31
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Silk View Post
    While on the subject of great Cena opponents, and considering I don't have the knowledge of Japanese or super old school wrestling to campaign for others, let it be known that I'm getting on my big CM Punk soapbox this year.
    Great wrestler, massively over, great talker, helped usher in a new style of wrestling to WWE.

    I think he's got more of an argument than most people mentioned in this thread. He won't make my cut because I'm pretty set in stone for my top 3, but I like the call.







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  12. #32

    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Cena is probably one of the most mixed bags of the century. He's had some great performances, shit performances, and average performances. It doesn't matter if he's on the undercard, in a title match, or in some other main event level grudge match, you never know what sort of quality you're going to get from him. There's plenty of years where he produced something that was worthy of being in the Worst Match of the Year discussion. Literally, the last match of his that I watched, was in that camp. Sometimes he had some MOTYCs too though. For a guy that was so incredibly inconsistent, he can't be great. Was there ever a year where he was clearly in the top three for best wrestlers in the company? I'd say no.

    He's clearly an unofficial member of every wrestling HOF though, including WC's. Which is completely deserving. It's not a question of if, but when he'll be inducted. I don't know if working the Firefly Funhouse match necessary helps his case to get inducted this year though. A really strong match against some IWC darling would have helped more.

  13. #33
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    Cena is probably one of the most mixed bags of the century. He's had some great performances, shit performances, and average performances. It doesn't matter if he's on the undercard, in a title match, or in some other main event level grudge match, you never know what sort of quality you're going to get from him. There's plenty of years where he produced something that was worthy of being in the Worst Match of the Year discussion. Literally, the last match of his that I watched, was in that camp. Sometimes he had some MOTYCs too though. For a guy that was so incredibly inconsistent, he can't be great. Was there ever a year where he was clearly in the top three for best wrestlers in the company? I'd say no.

    He's clearly an unofficial member of every wrestling HOF though, including WC's. Which is completely deserving. It's not a question of if, but when he'll be inducted. I don't know if working the Firefly Funhouse match necessary helps his case to get inducted this year though. A really strong match against some IWC darling would have helped more.
    ....he's already in our HOF.
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Peanutbutter View Post
    ....he's already in our HOF.
    Look up


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  15. #35
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by MC 16 View Post
    She was also one of top star of her era and way more influential than most other wrestlers. There is something to people considering her to be a GOAT Candidate 20 plus years after her prime.

    Chyna has accolades too - the Rumble, IC title win, etc. But it's quite below Toyota and a few others.
    im down with chyna


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  16. #36
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Let's throw it out there:

    If his Twitter image indicates permanent retirement, not the end of "Kassius Ohno", how would people feel about Hero getting nominations?

    In terms of his WWE tenure, then of course not. But his indy work is amongst the best ever. Then go back to the 2000's and he was a part of that crop of Indy guys who helped create a surge of interest in the scene after WCW and ECW folded. And he was even WC Wrestler of the Year in 2010, an amazing feat for an Indy talent.

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  17. #37

    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Postman Dave View Post
    Let's throw it out there:

    If his Twitter image indicates permanent retirement, not the end of "Kassius Ohno", how would people feel about Hero getting nominations?

    In terms of his WWE tenure, then of course not. But his indy work is amongst the best ever. Then go back to the 2000's and he was a part of that crop of Indy guys who helped create a surge of interest in the scene after WCW and ECW folded. And he was even WC Wrestler of the Year in 2010, an amazing feat for an Indy talent.
    If there's an indie darling that should be inducted, it should be CM Punk before Hero.

  18. #38
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Yeah, Hero was a better wrestler than Punk and probably a few of the other hall of famers we have, but I don't think he scratches the influence Punk had on wrestling.

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  19. #39
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    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Agreed with voting in Punk first. I think I nommed him last year, and will probably do the same this year.

    I know we're talking semantics here, but I don't really consider Punk to be an Indy darling at this point. I'd say his fame is more thanks to WWE now, whereas I think people would still associate Hero more with the Independents.

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  20. #40

    Re: 2020 Hall of Fame Ongoing Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Postman Dave View Post
    I know we're talking semantics here, but I don't really consider Punk to be an Indy darling at this point. I'd say his fame is more thanks to WWE now, whereas I think people would still associate Hero more with the Independents.
    That's just because Hero didn't do anything in the WWE.

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