Results 1 to 17 of 17

Thread: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

  1. #1
    Big Papa's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    16,576
    Rep Power
    1167115

    WWE Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    So a lot of us feel like the WWE is in a creative rut. Not everyone feels that way, or at least enjoys enough about the current product to be indifferent, but some of us are frustrated. The ratings are still declining and Network subscriptions are down. The WWE acknowledged the problems on-air back in the fall/winter and promised change - which don't hold true. Now they are apparently getting pressure from NBC and Fox over the ratings, and that's where this weeks "Wild Card" crossover stuff came from.

    The common trope has been that the WWE is at its best when they have competition. And it appears that they have that now. And yet....

    A qualification, as someone might argue the use of the term "competition". It might not be direct competition in the way that WCW at its best, but its competition. If they get TV and/or run more regular events, AEW might become that more direct competition. But even if AEW isn't getting on a notable network and directly bidding for talent, they are still an alternative for dissatisfied fans (although many of us will likely watch both). There is also obviously the growing North American profile of New Japan, with the MSG show being a water mark of some significance.

    So my point of discussion.... does WC believe that AEW and New Japan rising to be more direct and legitimate competition to the WWE's product will push the WWE to actually improve the product in a way that fans respond to in a positive manner? Or does the on-air acknowledgement and the "Wild Card" stuff and 73 year old head honcho who changes his mind on an hourly basis convince you that the are just not capable of that kind of change?
    EVERY ENDING IS A NEW BEGINNING.
    YOUR LUCKY NUMBER IS NONE.
    YOUR LUCKY COLOUR IS DEAD.
    Motto:
    LIKE FATHER, LIKE SON.



  2. #2
    WC Hall Of Famer

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    40,002
    Rep Power
    456103
      Country                    United States

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Lets not forget Vince is also trying to balance the XFL with heading WWE right now. He's doing a lot of behind the scenes with XFL right now. So this seems like a recipe for disaster when that starts off. Bruce Prichard said they were spread so thin with the first launch of the XFL. Vince seems to not want to take a smaller role with WWE right now, so until he does that I don't see how things change. If he's making the decisions the direction to me would seem to go the same way.

    With the Fox deal I just don't see how they increase ratings to the point of it being worth it for Fox. Same with the XFL being on ESPN and Fox. Who is not seeing both of these situations and saying they will be a complete disaster? I wonder if Fox has some backup plan where they move Smackdown to FS1 if it fails totally. The whole roster split to me makes sense, but at the same time seems to back them in a corner with 1. Matchups - we are seeing the same matches every single week 2. If there are injuries they have a tough time with figuring out how to go in another direction.

    I think AEW if their TNT deal goes through will certainly make some sort of splash, but at the end of the day the WWE needs to change their direction to try to please Fox. Right now I can't see how Fox looks at WWE is happy with what is currently going on. The problem is at this point what would really move the needle? What would improve ratings? With NXT talent it's crazy to me that they can't understand the basics. Years ago they would do all these cool builds for new wrestlers, give them packages for weeks to a month, and then debute a guy. Sometimes sure it would fail completely, but sometimes it would really build up and get you excited for a new person. This year they debuted multiple NXT guys as a panic move one night all on the same show. Which totally screwed those guys momentum right away.

    If WWE isn't going to make Smackdown and Raw different besides rope colors why even have a brand split? I understand they have a huge roster, and a brand split in theory would help them create new stars, and make people want to see certain shows. At the same time I think if they just went back to basics had one Heavyweight Champion, an Intercontinental Champion, Maybe bring back the Television Championship. How cool would it be if the US champion become the secondary Woman's title?

    I just think that direction would be so much better than the current product, ehh what the hell do I know.

    To answer your question, with Vince still in charge no I don't think AEW will make a difference in WWE creatively changing their ways haha.

  3. #3
    Admin in Lockdown

    Ed's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Dudley, England
    Posts
    39,598
    Rep Power
    4294128
      Country                    England

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Competition from AEW isn’t going to make the WWE product improve. It’s not like they’ve been the only alternative to WWE in recent years, New Japan have been trying to make their mark in America for several years now and ROH just ran MSG and it hasn’t led to WWE thinking they need to up their game. The last time someone went head to head with WWE it was TNA in 2010 and 2010 was one of the worst years for quality WWE programming this decade. I think the idea that competition = WWE improving is a myth based on one example of the Monday night wars 20 years ago.

    The threat of being cancelled by Fox for bad ratings is more what is going to lead to an overhaul and improvement in WWE’s programmes.

  4. #4
    People's Champion
    Baldrick's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Wales
    Posts
    5,634
    Rep Power
    959884
      Country                    Wales

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    I don't think the potential rise of AEW will change a great deal at the moment as they are way off where they would need to be to be considered "a threat". The biggest issue WWE face right now is keeping two separate networks happy with what they are producing, and sadly for us that'll probably mean more storylines that are trying to be entertaining rather than having that happy mix of story telling and in-ring work. I think until they get the right mix of writers on board and the right people in charge, nothing will really change.

    The XFL thing has to be a hindrance. Vince has to be doing too much. He's on TV at least once a week, we've not heard or seen anything to suggest he's stepping back at all, in a way he's a college student again burning the candle at both ends, and that's not going to be good for either adventure.
    I have a plan so cunning......

    #ShadeWinsLOL

  5. #5
    Big Papa's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    16,576
    Rep Power
    1167115

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed View Post
    Competition from AEW isn’t going to make the WWE product improve. It’s not like they’ve been the only alternative to WWE in recent years, New Japan have been trying to make their mark in America for several years now and ROH just ran MSG and it hasn’t led to WWE thinking they need to up their game. The last time someone went head to head with WWE it was TNA in 2010 and 2010 was one of the worst years for quality WWE programming this decade. I think the idea that competition = WWE improving is a myth based on one example of the Monday night wars 20 years ago.

    The threat of being cancelled by Fox for bad ratings is more what is going to lead to an overhaul and improvement in WWE’s programmes.
    In a sense, TNA was there for awhile at least attempting to be competition. They never rose to the level of being a threat. But companies that can potentially offer talent competitive income to the WWE changes the dynamics a bit.

    I didn't want to get too detailed on the explanation, but a blog I read didn't just talk about "competition" pushing the WWE to be better, but also how the WWE does often seem to do better when they forced to be creative. Like when injuries change plans and they have to go away from the wonderful McMahon template. The example used was the Mustafi Ali injury leading to Kofi getting hot, leading to his title chase.

    Kinda crazy that Fox is already pressing them months before the shows even switches

    And honestly, I forgot about the XFL being a factor for Vince.

    I'm not really convinced that AEW nor NJPW will make a difference to the WWE, not in the near future at least. And reactions to ratings pressure thus far has been more of a double-down effect than anything. They can't seem to realize that More McMahon's = / = ratings gold in 2019.
    EVERY ENDING IS A NEW BEGINNING.
    YOUR LUCKY NUMBER IS NONE.
    YOUR LUCKY COLOUR IS DEAD.
    Motto:
    LIKE FATHER, LIKE SON.



  6. #6
    King EC

    Mr. Peanutbutter's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Labrador Peninsula
    Posts
    11,768
    Rep Power
    2282746
      Country                    United States

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    I actually think WWE have tried to up their game since the midway point of last year. The road to WrestleMania was actually quite good this year and the event itself saw WWE doing a lot of fan service with faces winning all the big matches. I think the problem is that Vince has just come up with a lot of duds in that time as well and misunderstands a lot of why fans are becoming fed up with WWE (ie no story continuity, formulaic matches/promos, wrestlers having no aim and doing things for no reason).

    But as Ed pointed out, it's likely their attempts to "shake things up" have as much or more to do with appeasing networks than it does their bidding competitors. One way or another, they're in a struggle to maintain and draw in viewers that is probably greater than any they've experienced in about 20 years. And I enjoy seeing that. Hopefully the pressure will eventually force them to take a long look at what they're doing wrong and fix it.
    ​​​​​​​​ 2019 King of Wrestling Clique



    HOW ABOUT YOU READ THESE THINGS?

    Watching TNA's monthly PPVs from the start
    WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History

    Burn It Down!: The Top 25 Matches of Seth Rollins' Career

  7. #7
    Fearless University
    ETE's Avatar

    Status
    Online
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Perth, Australia
    Posts
    7,525
    Rep Power
    641678
      Country                    New Zealand

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Honestly Pro Wrestling is at such a low point right now, most of the fanbase has deserted and found something else. Competition might ideally force WWE to lift their game a bit but I dont think it'll really amount to anything. AEW is years and years away from being legit competition for the WWE, but what they do offer is an alternative, American based high paying option for Wrestlers looking at the WWE.




  8. #8
    [Run]
    Postman Dave's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    9,837
    Rep Power
    1624296
      Country                    England

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Quote Originally Posted by ETE View Post
    Honestly Pro Wrestling is at such a low point right now, most of the fanbase has deserted and found something else.
    Eh, I'd disagree with this because as a business it's healthier than ever. It's creatively I'd agree with this point.


    Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk

  9. #9
    Admin in Lockdown

    Ed's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Dudley, England
    Posts
    39,598
    Rep Power
    4294128
      Country                    England

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Yeah it's hard to say it's at a low point when more wrestlers outside of WWE are making a good living in this industry than they have done in 20 years and other promotions across the globe are doing great attendances. As bad as WWE's viewership is, they're earning fantastic money and are the leading company in women's wrestling being presented well, so they have a few things going for them at least.

  10. #10
    Fearless University
    ETE's Avatar

    Status
    Online
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Perth, Australia
    Posts
    7,525
    Rep Power
    641678
      Country                    New Zealand

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    I meant more in regards to popularity. Pro Wrestling is about as uncool and unpopular as its ever been, hence why the next sentence was about the fans deserting.




  11. #11
    [Run]
    Postman Dave's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    9,837
    Rep Power
    1624296
      Country                    England

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Quote Originally Posted by ETE View Post
    I meant more in regards to popularity. Pro Wrestling is about as uncool and unpopular as its ever been, hence why the next sentence was about the fans deserting.
    But it's not. WWE (and wrestling in general) is more mainstream than ever and indy companies are the most popular they've ever been, USA and Fox are not paying millions for an unpopular product, and cities aren't bidding millions to host Wrestlemania's if it's "unpopular and uncool".

    Sent from my Lenovo TB-X104F using Tapatalk

  12. #12
    Admin in Lockdown

    Ed's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Dudley, England
    Posts
    39,598
    Rep Power
    4294128
      Country                    England

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Yeah it's a really weak argument to suggest wrestling is uncool and unpopular atm. The Raw and SD ratings aren't good, but they are still strong in network subscribers, have millions watching their youtube videos every week, multiple wrestler reality TV show spin offs, Paige's story recently made into a hollywood movie, Ronda voice acting in Mortal Kombat. Then you look at other companies, New Japan is doing great numbers, ROH just had their highest ever attended show in April, wXw had their highest attended show ever in March, OTT having their biggest shows ever in Ireland, AEW sold out Double or Nothing (~11,000 fans) in 4 minutes.

    Comparing today to the attitude era or the 80s, sure it's not as popular. Compare today to 5 years ago, you'd have to say it's more popular worldwide and exciting today. I definitely come across more wrestler shirts out and about and hear of people attending shows more in 2019 than I did a few years ago.

  13. #13
    The Only 2x WC HOF
    Shock's Avatar

    Status
    Online
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    23,937
    Rep Power
    3206366
      Country                    Scotland

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Wrestling is huge nowadays and definitely isn't faultering outside of ratings, which are getting less relevant every year. Nerd culture has been leading mainstream entertainment for around a decade now and showing no signs of slowing down. And wrestling is a big part of that.

    Sent from my Moto E (4) Plus using Tapatalk







    The 100 Greatest WCW Matches - Coming Soon


    The 100 Greatest WWE Matches (1986 - 1995) - Coming Soon



    The 100 Greatest WWE Matches (1996 - 2005) - Completed



  14. #14
    King EC

    Mr. Peanutbutter's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Labrador Peninsula
    Posts
    11,768
    Rep Power
    2282746
      Country                    United States

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Wrestling is super mainstream these days. It's regularly featured on ESPN programming and a lot of major news outlets like Rolling Stone now cover it like they never have in the past. I seem to notice a lot more people who are open about their wrestling fandom than ever before, and that includes regular people as well as a celebrities. In the US at least, I think it's more accepted in society than it has been at any time since the Attitude Era ended and maybe even more so than that.
    ​​​​​​​​ 2019 King of Wrestling Clique



    HOW ABOUT YOU READ THESE THINGS?

    Watching TNA's monthly PPVs from the start
    WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History

    Burn It Down!: The Top 25 Matches of Seth Rollins' Career

  15. #15
    Big Papa's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    16,576
    Rep Power
    1167115

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    I would agree that wrestling and the WWE itself have a more mainstream profile than ever, at least here in North America. WWE gets coverage on ESPN's website here and there. Sports blogs I follow that generally focus on the bigger sports do give attention to wrestling, and even the indy stuff. Up here in Canada, TSN (our version of ESPN) recently had a one-hour show about Kenny Omega, and TSN doesn't even carry any wrestling currently. Its not abnormal to see a wrestler on a talk show. Even without a transcendent star currently, the overall profile just seems higher. think it probably helps (or helped) to have legit mainstream sports stars in Roussey and Lesnar in there.
    EVERY ENDING IS A NEW BEGINNING.
    YOUR LUCKY NUMBER IS NONE.
    YOUR LUCKY COLOUR IS DEAD.
    Motto:
    LIKE FATHER, LIKE SON.



  16. #16
    King EC

    Mr. Peanutbutter's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Labrador Peninsula
    Posts
    11,768
    Rep Power
    2282746
      Country                    United States

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Papa View Post
    I would agree that wrestling and the WWE itself have a more mainstream profile than ever, at least here in North America. WWE gets coverage on ESPN's website here and there. Sports blogs I follow that generally focus on the bigger sports do give attention to wrestling, and even the indy stuff. Up here in Canada, TSN (our version of ESPN) recently had a one-hour show about Kenny Omega, and TSN doesn't even carry any wrestling currently. Its not abnormal to see a wrestler on a talk show. Even without a transcendent star currently, the overall profile just seems higher. think it probably helps (or helped) to have legit mainstream sports stars in Roussey and Lesnar in there.
    Rocky coming back didn't hurt things either.
    ​​​​​​​​ 2019 King of Wrestling Clique



    HOW ABOUT YOU READ THESE THINGS?

    Watching TNA's monthly PPVs from the start
    WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History

    Burn It Down!: The Top 25 Matches of Seth Rollins' Career

  17. #17
    Tag Team Specialist
    Raye's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    1,348
    Rep Power
    605599
      Country                    Canada

    Re: Will "Competition" Make a Difference?

    Honestly I think it'll depend on the success of Double or Nothing, as well as the announcement of their TV deal. If not after that, then maybe we'll see after they legitimately start their tv schedule. Until then, same old shit probably.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •