Results 1 to 5 of 5

Thread: [TEW 2016/2020] A 2013 Mod in Progress - The YES! Mod

  1. #1
    Big Papa's Avatar

    Status
    Online
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    15,311
    Rep Power
    469902

    [TEW 2016/2020] A 2013 Mod in Progress - The YES! Mod


    A 2013 Mod in Progress - The YES! Mod




    The Basics

    What is TEW 2016: its Total Extreme Wrestling 2016, a text-based wrestling sim game created by Adam Ryland. Basically, you run a wrestling company. Book the shows, sign and fire talent, create the storylines, determine the results, etc. As I described it elsewhere, its like the WWE 2K games Universe mod, but with way more control and way less visuals.

    Ryland is the same developer who created Extreme Warfare Revenge almost two decades and it remains a popular game. TEW 2016 is the seventh version of the game. We have a discussion thread here on WC.

    Because TEW is not a freeware game like EWR was, it cannot come with trademarked materials. So including real companies and real wrestlers is a lawsuit waiting to happen. Due to that, TEW always features a fictional gameworld called the CornellVerse, which has slowly evolved and grown since TEW 2004.

    If you are interested in playing TEW, there is a demo available for TEW 2016 and TEW 2005 is available as freeware.

    What is TEW 2020: the forthcoming 8th version of the game. Ryland has been working on it for awhile and its in the later stages of development / early stages of testing. No release date has been announced yet.

    What is a Mod: just like for any other video game, its a modification. TEW is created to work with these. While some mods are fairly minor things like graphics, the most important mods are databases that allow you to book other game worlds. These include fictional / fantasy mods, real world historical mods, and current day real world mods. These are databases.

    TEW is a much deeper and more detailed game than EWR, which is a good thing. However, that also means that the database is much bigger and has more information. A bad thing, because it makes modding a lot more challenging. Not “hard” in every sense but definitely time-consuming. Due to this, you will find some serious deviation in the quality of mods available. I completely get it if a mod-maker hasn't taken the time to fill in the employment history on every worker in the mod, but you can also see where they have taken a basic worker template and used it over and over again for the entire indy scene in some regions. That's less cool.... but I get it.

    The Yes! Mod
    The Background: I've never created a mod before. I've been part of the Mod Squad and helped out (in a tiny way) on the ThunderVerse. I ended up creating an alternative version of the Mod Squad's May 2001 WCW Lives mod. It kinda happened by accident. In the beta testing phase of TEW 2016, I was testing the database conversion features and decided I waned to play the WCW Lives but with a different scenario on how WCW survives. That led to a lot of re-balancing and additions of future workers and promotions. Ironically, some of those future workers and promotions ended up getting included int he official release when the mod got converted over and updated properly by the Mod Squad.

    I have a bit of nostalgia for the 2009-2014 period of WWE. And wrestling as a whole in that period. But there isn't a solid, well balanced mod available yet, at least that I have found. A long while back, I asked around and was given an early version of the Real World Chronicles mod starting in 2013. It would be filled in and become the RWC mod that is released regularly still today. There were two primary issues with that mod. One is that it was put together in 2013, and not completed. So not only is it missing any workers who debuted after that but also missing plenty of young workers from certain regions. The mod had about 1500 workers to start, compared to almost double that for current releases of the RWC. The second problem is the balance and scaling of the mod. Its not wrong, but I have a difference preference. Which would essentially mean not only adding hundreds of workers to fill things, but also adjusting the workers already in the mod.

    Given the amount of work involved, I would pick up the project every so often, do a bit, get discouraged, and leave it again for awhile. So I came up with another approach that I think might work.... maybe...

    Why 2013?: there are real world historical mods for some of the more interesting periods in wrestling history – 1980, 1985, 1987, 1990, 1994, 1996, 1997, 1998, 2000, and 2001. There are pending mods for 2004 and 2011. One can find mods from different periods but they haven't been converted from earlier versions of the game and updated fully. So again, require work to be playable.

    The 2013 period feels like a transition point in a lot of ways. Mid-2013 was where the Yes movement really got underway, leading to Daniel Bryan's big moment at WM. The same WM where the Streak ended. CM Punk is still around, the Shield is at its peak, and the Wyatt family are monsters, not goofballs yet. The genesis of the Women's Revolution was happening, but not yet actually underway. NXT was starting to get interesting. The WWE Network would launch in 2014.

    But beyond the WWE, there is TONS of interesting stuff going on in the wrestling world at this time. New Japan has its golden period underway but nowhere near peaked. All Japan and Noah are both at low points, with the Burning exodus from Noah to All Japan just having happened. The BritWres scene is starting to heat up. wXw is starting to see the best of WALTER in Germany. The US indy scene had a lot of talent, and while TNA is on the decline, ROH still has a lot of potential. EVOLVE had a pretty awesome roster in the 2013-2016, full of workers who would end up in the WWE. Basically, mid-2013 feels like a period with a ton of potential and where things could be interesting to see unfold differently.

    The other period I really considered is 2009ish. The problem is that a lot of the guys who are now breaking out or hitting their peak were not around yet. Meaning you would have to get a couple of years into a save to start to see the BritWres scene take off, etc If this mod is ever finished, I might try to move it back in time to have a 2009 version as well.

    Real World Mods and What Do I Mean by “Balance”: as is commonly quipped about Football Manager, a text sim game is basically interacting with a database. So the quality of that database really does impact your game experience.

    The fundamental gameplay of TEW is to book shows. You run wrestling shows, with the intent of growing the company and being successful. That happens by running shows with good grades. The individual segment grades are determined by the skills of the workers involved, their popularity, and the product, then further impacted by a series of small factors. The overall company popularity then determines when the overall show grade is sufficient or not. So the individual worker skillsets, their individual popularity, and the company popularity all play a big role in the grades that are generated. This is true whether its a company you are running or the AI.

    The balance of the mod is essentially how the mod-maker has arranged the combination of individual workers. If its off, even in an area or a single company, things will play in a certain way. Perhaps intended, perhaps not. For example, if the WWE talent is all very skillful and popular, then getting strong grades with the WWE becomes really easy. Even if the worker skills are fine but their popularity is high, that will still happen (given that WWE is a popularity-driven product). That makes the WWE extremely easy to succeed with – again, that could be intended. Similarly, if an indy scene in a given region (a handful of smaller companies and enough talent to fill them) is scaled to be all average and below workers, it will mean that region will be unlikely to grow in a significant way.

    Scaling is similar to this. Its how the mod-maker chooses to use the range of specific individual skills and popularity. What do they want to be the peak in that gameworld? The average? Let's say you have decided that John Cena is the most popular individual worker in the mod. Does that mean he's A* popularity in his home region? Or do you scale lower, based on the logic that Steve Austin, The Rock, and Hulk Hogan were the peak of wrestling popularity in the United Stated and Cena has never hit the same individual level as them? Scaling of some attributes, as well as popularity, can have a really big impact. If you have a game-world that has a 100 workers with A* Psychology, that is a lot of workers capable of putting on top level matches. The grades generated will reflect that.

    When a mod-maker sets out to make a mod, they have determine how they want the balance and scaling to work. They can go for absolute accuracy (which is, again, subjective) or they can go for a certain intent. Different balances are thereby different gameplay experiences are not wrong, but they may appeal to different audiences. And this usually needs to be consistent throughout the mod. For example, how you want workers scaled when they debut? Should they be accurate to their skills at their debut age – let's say 22 years old – or accurate to their peak age? Or somewhere in between? And its kinda important for mod balance to be consistent with that.

    I realized in the 2K1 process that I don't have the patience to shoot for absolute accuracy. That takes a huge level of dedication, and I have massive respect for modders like Genadi, Mr. Creative, Hive, and others. Its one thing to spend a bunch of time bashing around the interwebz looking for info on an obscure worker.... but the time-dedication multiples quickly if you also spend time watching multiple matches for a lot of individuals to assess their skills as completely and accurately as possible. I'm way too lazy for that shit. And honestly, I want things to be produce results more than anything else.

    Which lead to me exploring an idea I've had for a long time (and may have taken from someone else's suggestion, entirely possible...)

    The Methodology: importing workers from the CornellVersse and the ThunderVerse, then editing them as needed to be the real world worker.

    The CornellVerse, as mentioned, is the default fictional universe. The ThunderVerse is a similar fictional universe created by a group of TEW fans, and its done well enough to get Ryland's official endorsements. Both have well balanced game-worlds that evolve relatively nicely. They feature an excellent spread of top level talent, young prospects, solid veterans, and indy filler. Most areas of the game world are filled in relatively nicely (with some minor exceptions),

    So my intent is to find workers that are relatively similar to the real world worker I want, import them, adjust the details, tweak the attributes and popularity a bit, and you now have the real world worker you want. Given that even if I import the worker from another mod, I still have to check all of that stuff, its not really a longer process and it ensues the detail work is done.

    The idea is that its more about slotting that working into the gameworld effectively to fill that role than the exact specific . So if I want a charismatic brawler to main event a national-sized company, I can find several of those in either mod. Change the details and I have John Cena. Rinse and repeat approximately 2000 times.

    Probably worth clarifying that the intent is absolutely not to replicate the overall game-world of either mod. The companies are being imported from the RWC 2013 mod and will be tweaked to be fairly close to accurate in terms of company popularity, product, etc. The game-world of each mod differs from reality in 2013 quite notably. The CornellVerse has three national promotions in the US, two in Japan, one in England, and a monstrously big and aggressive promotion in Mexico. Both game-worlds also tend to evolve in a fairly predictable and repetitive manner based on the specific companies they have.

    The Intent: to end up with a deep, detailed mod with a nice overall balance that allows companies to produce “realistic” results. By realistic, I mean grades that aren't really high or really low. I'm hopefully that most areas of the game world will have talent of almost all levels.

    And the purpose of this thread is mostly just for me to rant and ramble about things. Some folks might be interested – Jon, The EC, and some others. But its probably for my entertainment and motivation more than anything else.

    The Mod Details
    Start Date: May 1, 2013
    Active Promotions: 43
    Future Promotions: 5
    Active Male Workers: 55
    Active Female Workers: 5
    Future Male Workers: 1
    Future Female Workers: 1
    Non-Wrestlers: 2
    Estimated Overall Progress: 1%
    Last Updated: August 19, 2019

    Top 25 Workers in Game
    1. Hiroshi Tanahashi
    2. Bryan Danielson
    3. Kazuchika Okada
    4. CM Punk
    5. Shinsuke Nakamura
    6. AJ Styles
    7. Kota Ibushi
    8. Chris Jericho
    9. Kurt Angle
    10. Fergal Devitt
    11. John Cena
    12. The Undertaker
    13. Kenny Omega
    14. Rey Mysterio
    15. KENTA
    16. Tetsuya Naito
    17. El Generico
    17. Triple H
    18. HARASHImA
    19. El Generico
    20. Brock Lesnar
    21. Randy Orton
    22. Claudio Castagnoli
    23. Robert Roode
    24. Hirooki Goto
    25. Meiko Satomura


    Pending Questions I'm Seeking Opinions On
    Last edited by Big Papa; Yesterday at 10:06 PM.
    EVERY ENDING IS A NEW BEGINNING.
    YOUR LUCKY NUMBER IS NONE.
    YOUR LUCKY COLOUR IS DEAD.
    Motto:
    LIKE FATHER, LIKE SON.



  2. #2
    Big Papa's Avatar

    Status
    Online
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    15,311
    Rep Power
    469902

    Re: [TEW 2016/2020] A 2013 Mod in Progress - The YES! Mod

    What Can You Do

    I guess there is a purpose to posting this, beyond me vomiting up walls of text about the minutiae of progress I've made / not made. Some of you may be interested in helping out.

    Testing: once this is further along, testing will definitely be necessary. But as I didn't start adding talent in an overly systematic manner, no one company is anywhere near close to complete to be tested out.

    Suggest: this is a bit challenging without being able to see the data, I realize. But I'm open to suggestions on companies to include (a big ask in some ways) or workers to include (smaller). Or easier, workers that you feel are underrated and would like to see scaled more accurately. This might be based on other mods you've seen / played, or just how the given worker is generally perceived. My wrestling world knowledge is decent, not amazing, and I know that impacted how things ended up scaled in the 2K1 tweak. Areas where I have marginal familiarity suffered for it - Mexico as a whole, and the joshi scene definitely, the BritWres and European scene (beyond Progress) as well as some current indy talent that was just breaking out in the past couple of years. Jon was super helpful in suggesting workers to look at. So yeah, I'm definitely open to names.
    EVERY ENDING IS A NEW BEGINNING.
    YOUR LUCKY NUMBER IS NONE.
    YOUR LUCKY COLOUR IS DEAD.
    Motto:
    LIKE FATHER, LIKE SON.



  3. #3
    No One
    Jon Snow's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Westeros
    Posts
    13,383
    Rep Power
    800790
      Country                    Canada

    Re: [TEW 2016/2020] A 2013 Mod in Progress - The YES! Mod

    Low percentage chance I do end up helping but I dont watch much wrestling nowadays, and haven't opened up TEW '16 since they announced TEW '20 (I really wish I could get TEW '16 on my phone or Switch or browser, I'd sink hours into it). Looking forward to seeing the progress and with nearly a year till the next one is out, I feel like you have a lot of time to chip at this in time for something simmable by the next release. Good luck!

  4. #4
    Relentless Admin

    Ed's Avatar

    Status
    Online
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Dudley, England
    Posts
    36,587
    Rep Power
    2382455
      Country                    England

    Re: [TEW 2016/2020] A 2013 Mod in Progress - The YES! Mod

    I can help with info as best as I can.

  5. #5
    Big Papa's Avatar

    Status
    Online
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    15,311
    Rep Power
    469902

    Re: [TEW 2016/2020] A 2013 Mod in Progress - The YES! Mod

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Snow View Post
    Low percentage chance I do end up helping but I dont watch much wrestling nowadays, and haven't opened up TEW '16 since they announced TEW '20 (I really wish I could get TEW '16 on my phone or Switch or browser, I'd sink hours into it). Looking forward to seeing the progress and with nearly a year till the next one is out, I feel like you have a lot of time to chip at this in time for something simmable by the next release. Good luck!
    You will help and you will like it, young man!



    ....if you want to.

    Even if you aren't watching a ton going forward, the amount of wrestling knowledge you have will be super helpful. You watch a lot of stuff that I don't. I got to know a lot more about indy stars that I probably wouldn't have without your input on 2K1.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed View Post
    I can help with info as best as I can.
    Thanks, Ed.

    And honestly, you already have. The Best Workers of the 2010s project has given me a lot of information and ideas to work with. Some I was already more than aware of - Tomohiro Ishii and Daisuke Sekimoto, etc. But a few I was at least LESS aware of and they will end up being better in the mod for the hype. HARASHIMA, Rush, Hechicero, and others.

    But I will take any help I can get as a whole.

    _________________________________________________________________

    So added a bunch more wrestlers yesterday, so up over 70. Added a few more lady wrestlers - Kairii Hoho and the Shirai sisters. Well, Mio isn't completed yet but she's in there.

    Thinking what I might do is occasionally post a top 25 of workers in the mod, based on how the game ranks them. I don't want to go crazy and tweak heavily just because Wrestler A is higher than he should be, or lower. But it provides a nice guide. I started up a save last night and when looking over the rankings, Ishii looked low. But I didn't tweak him immediately, because how he ranks and he performs are different thing. But I did nerf Triple H a bit.

    I might also post specific questions I have and want opinion on. Because when it comes to worker skills and popularity.... its all pretty subjective.

    One thing I noticed last night when looking for joshi workers to import - neither the Cverse nor Tverse have the strongest scenes. Tverse is outright lacking - searching Very Good In-Ring Workers for Japanese females brings up 1 worker. Doing the same in the Cverse brings up more, but almost half of them are retired. Which is fine - I can use a retired wrestler as a base if they still have the in-ring skills. I might end up re-using some workers (no one would catch this, I expect) or import from other RW mods. Its going to be a hybrid mod anyway.

    As I mentioned, I very much will be going back to the RWC 2013 mod to import most of the non-wrestlers. Importing and adjusting announcers and refs seems really really unnecessary and does nothing for the basic reason to be using this approach in the first place. Its tempting to do a bunch of them, just to fill the mod out a bit, but not yet. Maybe once I hit 200 wrestlers. I imagine doing an import of refs, owners, and announcers could easily add 200-300 more workers. it would still take time to go through them as I want to be thorough.

    I've been trying to complete wrestlers when importing them. At first, I was leaving the bio and contracts. But now I'm trying to do that stuff as well. So I import the worker, and then I start by adjusting the basic details (name, DoB and debut date, nationality, body type, wrestler type, picture, etc). I add in their individual finishers and ensure the default gimmicks make sense. I then add in Employment history so that's done. Then I go through the relevant sections to adjust - Physical (their wear and tear), Performance (how they do with gimmicks of certain types), Personality, Lifestyle, Popularity, and then Skills. Both of those last two are subjective and tend to take the most work, but also the most likely to need to be tweaked going forward. How much adjustment the Skills require varies - some are almost dead on already, and some are way off. Then I create any Alter Egos (I don't go crazy on this), add in their biography and then create any contracts they have. Finally, I add agers (so their pic changes automatically), tag teams, relationships, etc. Trying to have a bit of fun with the bios. Some of the earliest additions, I didn't want to both with the bios, so I didn't do the alter egos or contracts. I've been picking away at those. Not a lot of them so it shouldn't be too bad.

    The focus thus far has been on top level workers. The Top 25 of the Top 500 workers in the game is probably reasonably accurate to who it will contain as a whole, as that's where my focus has been. There are still some pretty good workers to be added, but more veteran ones who may have top level Psychology but will be a bit more limited in other ways. I have added a couple of workers who are mid-level types to the British scene, but I kinda wanna fill out more of this, so I'll try to grab random workers from random indy promotions to add in. The likes of Andy Simmonz, Josh Bodom, Robert Dreissker, Trent Berretta, or Nick Aldis. Not workers that suck, but also not top class ones. Mediocre types. Which truthfully form the backbone of the mod since there are way more of them as a whole than the top level workers.
    EVERY ENDING IS A NEW BEGINNING.
    YOUR LUCKY NUMBER IS NONE.
    YOUR LUCKY COLOUR IS DEAD.
    Motto:
    LIKE FATHER, LIKE SON.



Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 2 users browsing this thread. (1 members and 1 guests)

  1. Big Papa

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •