Page 13 of 13 FirstFirst ... 3111213
Results 241 to 253 of 253

Thread: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

  1. #241

    Jiggy's Avatar

    Status
    Online
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Tampa, Fl
    Posts
    6,155
    Rep Power
    669116

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Quote Originally Posted by Shock View Post
    I'd say Orton was more popular in 2010 than Edge ever was. Certainly more popular than Edge ever was as a face.
    Probably closer to 2011 if we are talking about his big face turn around that time? When he stopped shaving

  2. #242
    TAKE THE DREAM~

    MC 16's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Dundee's Punches
    Posts
    5,499
    Rep Power
    433891
      Country                    England

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jiggy View Post
    Probably closer to 2011 if we are talking about his big face turn around that time? When he stopped shaving
    First Orton then Bryan. Facial Hair = Over confirmed.
    Spoiler:


    Milano Forever!

  3. #243
    THE MAN

    Ed's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Dudley, England
    Posts
    33,400
    Rep Power
    1402079
      Country                    England

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Quote Originally Posted by JakeYourBooty View Post
    That’s ridiculous he was insanely over at one point fuck E&C were over as a tag team more than Orton ever has been


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    Attitude Era will do that to you. Godfather's been more over than Orton in that regard.

    When they were on the roster at the same time, I think it's a lot closer.

  4. #244
    The Only 2x WC HOF
    Shock's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    20,302
    Rep Power
    954471

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Haha, I'd love to subscribe to the facial hair = over theory, but I meant 2010 when he turned face after legacy. He was getting the best reactions in the company for a long time.

  5. #245

    The EC's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    7,142
    Rep Power
    232099
      Country                    United States

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    I think Orton's theme even today will get a louder pop than most of anything Edge did as a singles star that I can remember. I seem to remember a good pop when he speared Bischoff and I'm sure there are a couple of others but the reactions Orton gets just by showing up say a lot about how big of a deal he is to the WWE Universe. As I said earlier I do think a lot of people have convinced themselves that Orton is not as good as he is/was because he's a known douche. He's had some great stretches in his career as Shock and Ed have pointed out. His feuds with Christian, Bryan, Foley, Taker and even Rollins rank up there pretty high for me as far as post-Attitude storylines. Ultimately though I think they're very close in how they'd rank. I gave the nod to Orton by just one point largely because they are close in most respects but Orton's going to be a guy that WWE talk about plenty even when he's gone imo.

  6. #246
    Underdog
    Keefmoon's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    297
    Rep Power
    135753
      Country                    Europe

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    I'd say both guys are pretty similar. Very over, but never the top guy. Beneficiaries of the two world titles era. Similiar-ish tenure (ie more than a decade). Similar-ish kayfabe accomplishments. Seen as future stars from day one, and pushed until they made it. Better as a heel than a face, but not unover as a face. Injury-prone. Had some red hot periods, but with some dead zones. Good-great workers, but tending to work "up" to their opponent (or down). Arguably, both are beneficiaries of pop-worthy entrance themes. There's not a great deal in them.

    I think the difference is a) Edge's push felt more organic, even if it wasn't, and as such he doesn't seem as forced, b) Edge seems more likeable, despite being wrestling's Ross Gellar, and c) Edge more clearly influenced things going forward.

    With the latter point, you can argue Edge:

    - Helped usher the in-ring change from 1999 to 2000 as a part of E&C
    - Helped make Ladder and TLC matches what they are now
    - Was the one who laid most of the MitB tropes

    You can also potentially argue every heel now has to be a version of the "Ultimate Opportunist", although the degree to which that's Edge's influence can be disputed. What is harder to dispute is in 2005-07 it felt like every heel was trying to be "cool", and he was one of the few to get genuine heel reactions, and yet not X-Pac heat.

    Personally, I'm not sure what the arguments are for Orton having "left something behind" when he's gone. He's an amalgamation of things that worked before. Even his most over tool, the RKO, is taken from elsewhere. Even the "outta nowhere" thing was DDP's (and Kanyon's!) shtick before.





  7. #247

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Quote Originally Posted by MC 16 View Post
    Randy Orton was inconsistent in his career but he offered far more than Edge ever did IMO. More memorable title reigns like his 2007-08 run. He had way better matches in his career than Edge like his matches with Christian, Bryan, Taker all of which far outdid anything Edge did in a singles role IMO. He arguably had bigger and better feuds, I prefer his feud with Taker over the Edge/Taker feud. And unlike Edge, he actually evolving his character over time. Edge basically had the same character since 2005 until his return in 2010. Now that's not really a bad thing if it's successful which is was, to be fair. Orton switched between different roles throughout his career quite regularly. And as for Orton's not so great face turns, Edge's face runs are so forgettable. Whenever he was left on his own as a face, Edge was a bore to watch and whenever he was Edge was a face, he wasn't hugely over as one. You could argue his last years. He was very over in that period but in other times, he wasn't massively over as one if he was on his own. Orton at least has his 2012 run to hang his head on. And not only that, his finisher is so over that he can't use it without getting massive babyface cheers even as a heel.
    The only time period with Edge as a face where it just didn't work was with his return in 2004. The fans just weren't into him, but it's more of an example of the crowd not getting behind this new serious and angry Edge like they did with the jokester Edge. Luckily, the WWE recognized that there was a problem and once they started the transition into making him a heel, things got better.

    I don't get how Orton is known for evolving his character while Edge hadn't. Edge literally went from being an ultimate mystery guy to a vampire, to an over the top douchebag, to a likable jokester, to super angry and serious, to a whiney asshole, to an ultimate opportunist, to then just settling into a role of going back and forth between having honor and giving into taking the easy way out. Sure, did he change much after 2005? Not really, but you typically don't alter things much once you find something that works.

    Meanwhile, there's Orton. He started off as an unremarkable rookie, to a cocky rookie, that evolved into being a legend killer, he had a brief period of honor before just reverting back to being a legend killer, the legend killer eventually became more deadly, then he found some honor and since then he goes back and forth between being a heel and a face. I don't see much character evolution there.

    As far as your argument goes, I don't think it's the best strategy to bring up Orton/Taker vs Edge/Taker when the Edge/Taker matches are so highly regarded while no one talks up the Orton/Taker matches as much. It's not quite fair, but a far better feud comparsion that works in Orton's advantage is Orton/Christian vs Edge/Christian. It's not quite the same thing since the E&C program was just a midcard one, but quality wise, Orton/Christian absolutely smokes the E&C matches out of the water. Out of all other possible feuds, Orton/Christian works best in the favor of showcasing Orton being better than Edge.

  8. #248
    The Only 2x WC HOF
    Shock's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    20,302
    Rep Power
    954471

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Edge failed as a face in 2010 too. It's probably the worst time period for him as he was basically turned into a Cena rip off with horrible comedy.

    That said none of Edge's face runs were as bad as Orton's 2004 baby-face run.

    Sent from my Moto E (4) Plus using Tapatalk

  9. #249
    Established Veteran
    Kintaro's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,507
    Rep Power
    17456

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Quote Originally Posted by Postman Dave View Post

    Random thought but interested in what people say. What specifically places Edge so much higher up than Randy Orton?

    Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk
    Yeah I also want everyone’s thoughts on why CM Punk is higher than Randy Orton and Rey Mysterio? I never voted for Punk, really shocked that he’s so high in this list.

    Mick Foley’s a little bit high for me, maybe 2-3 spots. Angle has a good spot at #14, seems about right. Bruno and Andre outside the top 10 is a bit surprising but they still have good spots.

    Jericho‘s one of my all time favourites. Expected him to make the top 20 but surprised to see him make the top 10. Glad he made it. Expecting Macho Man or HHH to be next.



  10. #250

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kintaro View Post
    Yeah I also want everyone’s thoughts on why CM Punk is higher than Randy Orton and Rey Mysterio? I never voted for Punk, really shocked that he’s so high in this list.
    Just off of the top of my head, I'd say Punk had one of the most well known promos in the last decade of WWE. Far bigger than any promo by Orton or Mysterio. At least in Orton's case, Punk's best is clearly better than Orton's best. Punk's emergence and push up the card, especially when he never seemed to be very easy to get along with behind the scenes, greatly opened the door for indie wrestlers to get a chance in the WWE. Although I'd say Bryan is more of an example of someone who helped shape the WWE by altering the style and bringing in a bunch of indie talents, without Punk, I don't know if Bryan ever gets a chance in the WWE, especially in a big push. Say what you will about the "CM Punk" chants post-Punk leaving, but what are the chances that anyone will ever chant for Orton once he's gone? We already know based on Mysterio time away from the WWE that the crowd won't be chanting for him either.

  11. #251
    [Knockin' on Heaven's Door]
    Postman Dave's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    7,829
    Rep Power
    397975
      Country                    England

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kintaro View Post

    Yeah I also want everyone’s thoughts on why CM Punk is higher than Randy Orton and Rey Mysterio? I never voted for Punk, really shocked that he’s so high in this list.
    This one is easier. Higher quality of matches, way more popular at his peak (outsold Cena in merch for a period), his year+ title reign is more notable and memorable than any of the others, and still gets chants almost 5 years after leaving.



    Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk

  12. #252
    Established Veteran
    Kintaro's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,507
    Rep Power
    17456

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Fair enough, I’ve just ever been a fan of Punk. I didn’t mind him from 2006-8, post 2009 is when I started to dislike him. At work so I can’t do a long post. It will be interesting if Cena makes the top 5, he has a good chance of making it.



  13. #253

    The EC's Avatar

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    7,142
    Rep Power
    232099
      Country                    United States

    Re: WC's Greatest Superstars in WWE History - THE COUNTDOWN!

    Post-2009 is when Punk really took off.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •