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Thread: What is the problem with raw?

  1. #1
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    What is the problem with raw?

    Last night Raw by all accounts from people who watched raw was either boring or rubbish and this brigs the question what is the problem for raw. Is it the length of the show (3 hours), is it the matches, the storylines, the wrestlers or segments? Is it a factor in all of them? Over the past months there were new of the lowest ratings since 1997 every few weeks and they acted on that and had he shake up but it doesn't have seemed to work in fact it seems have made it worse.

    I don't watch raw for reasons like, it gets boring, I get annoyed at the booking a lot of the time but that's personal choice and I was wondering why don't other people watch raw, it can't be coincidence that since its went from 2 hours to 3 hours have lost a third of their audience but since that won't be changed for financial matters so how would you improve raw?

    Something needs to change on raw, the question is what's the problem and how can it improve?
    Last edited by MC 16; 05-09-2017 at 03:54 PM.
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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    The Simple Answer Is That It Is To Long
    Coupled With That there Is Way To Much Filler On The Show, And They Don't Have Enough Wrestlers That Capture Peoples Interest Enough to Invest 3 + Hours Every Monday

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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Roman Reigns
    Looking for a partner to do a be the booker with.

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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Too long, lacking creativity, lacking consistency, often baffling, rarely intentionally funny, and a strong sense of stubborness in the booking of certain characters that is not limited to just Roman Reigns.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dakstang
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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Quote Originally Posted by Malcolm Ecstasy View Post
    Too long, lacking creativity, lacking consistency, often baffling, rarely intentionally funny, and a strong sense of stubborness in the booking of certain characters that is not limited to just Roman Reigns.
    I agree it's not just reigns but you put a good focus point at the start of the show it gets more viewers
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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Quote Originally Posted by PhenomenalOne View Post
    Roman Reigns
    it's not like the fans hurt every performance he goes out there and does.

    he's not that great but do we have to blame him for everything?






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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Yeah Length is the key issue here. While obviously you have all the booking and creativity issues SD also suffers from those same issues and is still more tolerable since it's an hour shorter.

    Cutting out the hour wouldn't solve all their problems, but it would at least give them space to breath week on week.







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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Quote Originally Posted by CGS View Post
    Yeah Length is the key issue here. While obviously you have all the booking and creativity issues SD also suffers from those same issues and is still more tolerable since it's an hour shorter.

    Cutting out the hour wouldn't solve all their problems, but it would at least give them space to breath week on week.
    do you honestly think they'll cut the 3 hours at this point?
    Last edited by Bones; 05-10-2017 at 06:18 AM.






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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bones View Post
    do you honestly think they'll cut the 3 hours at this point?
    Nope, they make too much through ad revenue.

    If anything, Smackdown going 3 hours is more likely.

    Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk

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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Quote Originally Posted by Postman Dave View Post
    Nope, they make too much through ad revenue.

    If anything, Smackdown going 3 hours is more likely.

    Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk
    Don't they already refer to Talking Smack as the third hour of SmackDown?.






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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bones View Post
    do you honestly think they'll cut the 3 hours at this point?
    Nope. Like Dave said they make way to much money to cut it. While it could be just playing up to the cameras i'm pretty sure both HHH & Vince have indirectly said they would prefer it to be 2 hours long, the whole 3 hour things sounds like more of a USA network thing than a WWE thing. WWE still benefit from it though hence why they never really push back on it.

    At least Talking Smack is an independent show away from the main show. Unlike the 3 hour raws you don't really need to watch Talking Smack to follow the whole story.







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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    I actually think they've been much improved since the superstar shakeup:

    - Angle as a babyface GM is a welcome break from Stephanie's promos
    - Miz and Ambrose were two of Smackdown's more reliable performers and talkers. It gives Raw a boost in an area they were struggling in (live in ring talking segments)
    - Anything they do with Finn Balor right now feels fresh and potentially they can get back on track to making him one of the biggest stars in the company like they tried to do at summerslam. He seems a lot more comfortable in his own skin now on the main roster and so far I've enjoyed him more than his NXT run. With the club right under his nose there's some interesting directions they can go with him.
    - BRAUN is amazing and I've enjoyed his feud with Roman. Shame about the injury.
    - The removal of Charlotte and the arrival of Alexa Bliss has broken the strangle hold the horsewomen were having on the Raw women's division. They seem to be doing more with Nia now too.
    - Tag division is more interesting with the Hardys as champions, Sheamus and Cesaro getting a heel push, The Revival waiting in the wings to return and no more fucking New Day stinking up the show with their comedy. Just doing something as simple as those Golden Truth segments the past few weeks made me thing there was an outside chance that jobber team was gonna win the turmoil match this week.

    I'm not saying it's a great show, but it has improved from where it was and they've at least got a bit of excitement from the draft compared to SD that's gone downhill. Payback was pretty solid and I think they're going in a good direction to build to the next PPV. The big test will be in a few months time when the dust has settled from the draft and the fresh factor isn't there anymore. I do think they're missing the focus of the Universal title and the sooner Brock comes back to defend it the better. Although I do like that the champion isn't on every week wrestling, it would just be nice to have a happy middle ground there.

    3 hours is still too long for a weekly wrestling show but it's been the more entertaining show than the 2 hour Smackdown or the 1 hour NXT recently so I think we need to move on from that tired reasoning on why Raw isn't as enjoyable as people want it to be.

    FYI the reason this week got shit on in terms of response and interest level is because the show was taped and that seems to happen every time they're in the UK. People read the results and decide not to bother.

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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Raw still has a list of flaws but right now, it is better than Smackdown for at least the first time since the brand extension. There's a lot more interesting than uninteresting on Raw and so many things have improved (the Women's Division, BRAUUUNNN, Cruiserweight Division getting better, The Miz, a great Hardy/Sheamusaro feud, Balor improving, Kurt Angle, etc.) Their booking isn't perfect but it feels more easier to consume than Smackdown's wacky booking as of late.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaiZ-R View Post
    What the fuck is happening to you guys? I once got a blowjob where she used her teeth a little bit too much and I ended up with a bloody dick, I still enjoyed the blowjob up to the point I started bleeding. I can honestly say that I have never had anything I would call a bad blowjob, that wasn't a great experience but up until I started gushing blood I was having a great time!

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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    I think the Shake Up actually screwed over SDL and didn't help RAW at all. Miz is now being wasted on RAW, while SDL has Jinder Mahal as a top heel in a world title feud.

    RAW's biggest issue is that nothing matters on the show unless you're Brock Lesnar or someone Vince/HHH cares about. And even Owens' world title reign was unmemorable and pointless. If RAW made things matter on the show, then it would be must see. Right now, not even reading the results feels necessary.

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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Legend Killer View Post
    I think the Shake Up actually screwed over SDL and didn't help RAW at all. Miz is now being wasted on RAW
    Like Styles when he said SmackDown makes the superstars and Raw steals them.






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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Creative and booking is the biggest problem. And because of that, so is the 3 hours .
    A Champ that shows up once in 2 or 3 months makes a title worthless (yes, it's a fake sport but still, storyline wise)
    Putting the title on someone who came back just because of being in a WWE game, not to mention someone who could still not wrestle a match over 4 minutes hurt Raw.
    Other than Braun and very few others having character development, that was bad for Raw.
    The trying to get Nia Jax over when she still has a lot of work to do hurt 5he woman's division.
    Steph, while nice to look at, all her tv time hurt Raw.
    Reigns really isn't hurting the shows all that much. It's a given he is the new Cena . Even if they eld bqck with him a bit, the shows will not improve.

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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Everyone pretty much hitting nail on head so I will say something a little different they didnt try to push new stars the exception is Braun and Finn. Look at SD They brought in on the first night having DZ beat AJ and face Dean it was different no one excepted it SD is the place where anything can happen RAW is the place where you make the big bucks where you are in primetome

  18. #18
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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    I know its a bit generic/cliche but Roman Reigns. Or rather WWE's vision for him and their unyielding relentlessness to push him as the unstoppable super babyface.

    The entire show really revolves around Roman. The big one of course is the current Universal Title picture which revloves around Roman even though he hasn't had a Title match since the Rumble(?). Brocks only Champ so that Roman can dethrone him at WM 34. So the rest of the Raw roster is denied the chance to be World Champ, and/or establish themselves as a Main Eventer because the Title is being held hostage by the Reigns megapush.

    On top of that there's the rumour that Miz will beat Ambrose just so Roman has a heel IC Champion to squash. So there's no point getting invested in either guy right now when they're just pawns to further "make Roman look strong".

    I'm not even against Roman as a top guy, of all the people in this era he screams "Main Event" more than 99% of them. He's a good big man Main Eventer capable of some fun matches, they just have to stop trying to force a square peg into a round hole. You look at the talent Raw has, and I wont just limit this to the guys I consider talented, but as a potential Main Event scene you have Miz, Braun, Ambrose, Wyatt, Reigns, Rollins, Balor, Matt Hardy, Jeff Hardy, Seth Rollins, and guys like Sheamus, Joe and Cesaro on top of that. That could be a great Upper midcard/Main Event scene(s), but everything they do ultimately revolves around giving Roman another big win.

    I dont feel like length is a real issue anymore, at least not within the current WWE product. SmackDown is worse than Raw in my opinion. Two hours a week isn't really enough. Look at SmackDowns tag division; its just Breezeango in squash matches and an Uso promo every week. I cant remember the last Uso match, American Alpha are MIA, there's not enough time for multiple tag division segments. Womens division is no better, every week its just all the women lumped into one mess of a segment where none of them really look good. Guys like Corbin when he still had momentum late last year/early this year would randomly miss a show here and there because they didn't have the time. At least on Raw every story is developed/pushed every week. On SDL with two hours feuds/storylines just die and lose momentum every now and then and then need to be kickstarted back up.

    The entire WWE product is horrendously flawed and putrid. There's so many issues with the WWE product on every level.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bones View Post
    Like Styles when he said SmackDown makes the superstars and Raw steals them.
    To be fair come shakeup time the only star SDL had "made" and didn't drop the ball on was Alexa Bliss and to an extent Baron Corbin, but even he feels unimportant lately. Everyone else that SmackDown made they had since dropped the ball on; Wyatt, Miz, Usos, American Alpha, Becky Lynch, Heath Slater.

    In that same time period Raw made Balor, Braun, Owens and Charlotte into stars, and didn't drop the ball on them or reduce them to feeling like they were just aimlessly floating around.

    Dont get me wrong for most of the draft SmackDown was the far superior show. Raw was very much same old, same old WWE; Rollins, Reigns, New Day, Horsewomen, etc. dominating things while SmackDonw had fresher faces on top like Styles, Miz and Ziggler. But the quality of the SmackDown product nosedived at the start of this year and alot of the guys they had built up on SDL were left floundering around aimlessly. Alpha's main roster run so far is one of the most badly botched things WWE have done in a long time; they took a talented, fresh, fun tag team, that could easily get over and booked them in such a way that no one cares about them, and their first tag Title run was an absolute dud, and best forgotten so they can start fresh.
    Last edited by ETE; 05-20-2017 at 06:34 AM.


    Thanks to Jabberwocky for the amazing Gabrielle gif


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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    Quote Originally Posted by ETE View Post
    I know its a bit generic/cliche but Roman Reigns. Or rather WWE's vision for him and their unyielding relentlessness to push him as the unstoppable super babyface.

    The entire show really revolves around Roman. The big one of course is the current Universal Title picture which revloves around Roman even though he hasn't had a Title match since the Rumble(?). Brocks only Champ so that Roman can dethrone him at WM 34. So the rest of the Raw roster is denied the chance to be World Champ, and/or establish themselves as a Main Eventer because the Title is being held hostage by the Reigns megapush.

    On top of that there's the rumour that Miz will beat Ambrose just so Roman has a heel IC Champion to squash. So there's no point getting invested in either guy right now when they're just pawns to further "make Roman look strong".

    I'm not even against Roman as a top guy, of all the people in this era he screams "Main Event" more than 99% of them. He's a good big man Main Eventer capable of some fun matches, they just have to stop trying to force a square peg into a round hole. You look at the talent Raw has, and I wont just limit this to the guys I consider talented, but as a potential Main Event scene you have Miz, Braun, Ambrose, Wyatt, Reigns, Rollins, Balor, Matt Hardy, Jeff Hardy, Seth Rollins, and guys like Sheamus, Joe and Cesaro on top of that. That could be a great Upper midcard/Main Event scene(s), but everything they do ultimately revolves around giving Roman another big win.

    I dont feel like length is a real issue anymore, at least not within the current WWE product. SmackDown is worse than Raw in my opinion. Two hours a week isn't really enough. Look at SmackDowns tag division; its just Breezeango in squash matches and an Uso promo every week. I cant remember the last Uso match, American Alpha are MIA, there's not enough time for multiple tag division segments. Womens division is no better, every week its just all the women lumped into one mess of a segment where none of them really look good. Guys like Corbin when he still had momentum late last year/early this year would randomly miss a show here and there because they didn't have the time. At least on Raw every story is developed/pushed every week. On SDL with two hours feuds/storylines just die and lose momentum every now and then and then need to be kickstarted back up.

    The entire WWE product is horrendously flawed and putrid. There's so many issues with the WWE product on every level.



    To be fair come shakeup time the only star SDL had "made" and didn't drop the ball on was Alexa Bliss and to an extent Baron Corbin, but even he feels unimportant lately. Everyone else that SmackDown made they had since dropped the ball on; Wyatt, Miz, Usos, American Alpha, Becky Lynch, Heath Slater.

    In that same time period Raw made Balor, Braun, Owens and Charlotte into stars, and didn't drop the ball on them or reduce them to feeling like they were just aimlessly floating around.

    Dont get me wrong for most of the draft SmackDown was the far superior show. Raw was very much same old, same old WWE; Rollins, Reigns, New Day, Horsewomen, etc. dominating things while SmackDonw had fresher faces on top like Styles, Miz and Ziggler. But the quality of the SmackDown product nosedived at the start of this year and alot of the guys they had built up on SDL were left floundering around aimlessly. Alpha's main roster run so far is one of the most badly botched things WWE have done in a long time; they took a talented, fresh, fun tag team, that could easily get over and booked them in such a way that no one cares about them, and their first tag Title run was an absolute dud, and best forgotten so they can start fresh.
    Having the show focused non-stop and solely produced to make Roman the Universal champion is the big problem. I don't like Roman, but he does feel like a main event star. The issue really is that because things are more or less "set in stone", every other character on the show is pointless. Why should we get behind someone, if we know for a fact there is no chance for them to ever make it to the top on RAW? I remember about 10 years ago, when Edge was SmackDown! and facing the Undertaker, I was really behind Edge in every match because I believed he had a chance of beating Undertaker and becoming world champion. That is the beauty of pro-wrestling, which RAW is lacking. The possibility that someone could make it to the top, someone can get that world title, someone that you backed from their debut until that moment of winning the title. That's why Daniel Bryan's build to the WM win was so amazing, there was the chance and we were eager to see it. Nothing felt "destined", even though we did expect it to happen, it still wasn't certain. Roman vs. Brock for the Universal title seems destined and it's certain Roman will win. So then, why even care about Miz or Ambrose or anyone else? Their fans want to see them climb up the card, or even just know there is a chance. If your world title is completely locked down, it makes the whole show less fun.

    Where are the days of upper midcard stars actually getting title shots, teasing us that they have a chance - that they matter to the show? If - a decade and more ago - the world title was booked how it's been booked on RAW for the last few years, we'd probably have never gotten Edge, CM Punk, Jeff Hardy, Miz, Sheamus, Alberto, Rey Mysterio, Daniel Bryan, Chris Jericho etc. Some of those names I don't even like, but the fact that variety was there at least made us viewers believe that anyone that worked hard and got a push, had a chance. When was the last time a midcard guy like Rusev got a title shot? While in the past guys like Mr. Kennedy, Carlito, Chris Masters, John Morrison etc. got world title matches. The show just isn't fun anymore knowing that no one except the select few will ever touch the Universal title and I think that is the major difference in RAW and SDL.

  20. #20
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    Re: What is the problem with raw?

    It's no longer The Attitude Era. That is what is wrong with Raw.

    Just as we would not send any of our soldiers to march in other states and tyrannize other people, so will we never allow the armies of others to march into our State and tyrannize our people.

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