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Thread: The Ask Jim Thread

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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Jim, why do you think VKM and Macho had the falling out? Some say the Stephanie Rumors, some say the Slim Jim deal when he went to WCW, etc. What is your opinion?

  2. #2702

    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Cloud Strife View Post
    Jim, why do you think VKM and Macho had the falling out? Some say the Stephanie Rumors, some say the Slim Jim deal when he went to WCW, etc. What is your opinion?
    To be honest, I don't even think they had a proper falling out. I wouldn't even say their initial split had any real heat to it. McMahon felt like Savage was too old to be a featured wrestler, but Savage wasn't ready to step away from the ring. Eventually, Savage asked to leave and he was allowed to.

    Right away, you can dismiss the Stephanie rumors. There's zero reason to believe that they're true since Vince actually gave Savage a very nice farewell when Macho Man left in 1994 and what people tend to either forget about or are unaware of is that Savage actually had an interview with Smackdown magazine back in 2003. The first Savage WWE DVD came out when he was still alive. Although there wasn't a ton of interaction, especially directly, between the WWE and Savage, the WWE never tried to wiped Savage from history. If the Stephanie rumors had been true, there's zero reason for the WWE working with Savage as much as they did during his life.

    As far as the Slim Jim deal goes, McMahon probably wasn't thrilled about losing that as a sponsorship, but he willingly let Savage go after barely using him for two years. Since Savage wasn't the first WWE wrestler to have the Slim Jim sponsorship (Ultimate Warrior had it first), perhaps McMahon was under the impression that the company would allow the WWE to pick a new wrestler to take Savage's role, before Slim Jim revealed that they'd stick with Savage. Besides, if there's anyone that McMahon would be upset with due to this deal, it would be Slim Jim, not Savage.

    I think it all comes down to money. By the end of the 90s, Savage no longer had much desire to wrestle, likely because of his age, past injuries, and the fact that he probably wasn't hurting for money, that you'd have to pay a lot of money to get him interested in working with you. The fact that he wrestled so few times after 2000 is a sign that his asking price was far too high, even for those money marks companies. McMahon isn't stupid. If he knows your asking price is one you won't budge on, but it's also a number that he doesn't feel is worth paying you, he's not going to keep trying to bring you in. Had Savage's asking price been lower, I'm sure the WWE wouldn't have had a single problem to bring him in for a few matches in the early 2000s.

    Say what you will about McMahon, but he's proven time after time that when it comes to business, he's willing to put aside any past issues if it means making money.

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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Which of these tag teams do you think the average fan is more familiar with: Antonino Rocca & Miguel Pérez, Fabulous Kangaroos or The Graham Brothers?


  4. #2704

    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by LibSuperstar View Post
    Which of these tag teams do you think the average fan is more familiar with: Antonino Rocca & Miguel Pérez, Fabulous Kangaroos or The Graham Brothers?
    Uhh, I guess the Graham Brothers simply because they were talked about a very tiny bit in the last 30 years? I can't imagine the average wrestling fan will know shit about any of them other than hearing their names before, if that.

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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    To be honest, I don't even think they had a proper falling out. I wouldn't even say their initial split had any real heat to it. McMahon felt like Savage was too old to be a featured wrestler, but Savage wasn't ready to step away from the ring. Eventually, Savage asked to leave and he was allowed to.

    Right away, you can dismiss the Stephanie rumors. There's zero reason to believe that they're true since Vince actually gave Savage a very nice farewell when Macho Man left in 1994 and what people tend to either forget about or are unaware of is that Savage actually had an interview with Smackdown magazine back in 2003. The first Savage WWE DVD came out when he was still alive. Although there wasn't a ton of interaction, especially directly, between the WWE and Savage, the WWE never tried to wiped Savage from history. If the Stephanie rumors had been true, there's zero reason for the WWE working with Savage as much as they did during his life.

    As far as the Slim Jim deal goes, McMahon probably wasn't thrilled about losing that as a sponsorship, but he willingly let Savage go after barely using him for two years. Since Savage wasn't the first WWE wrestler to have the Slim Jim sponsorship (Ultimate Warrior had it first), perhaps McMahon was under the impression that the company would allow the WWE to pick a new wrestler to take Savage's role, before Slim Jim revealed that they'd stick with Savage. Besides, if there's anyone that McMahon would be upset with due to this deal, it would be Slim Jim, not Savage.

    I think it all comes down to money. By the end of the 90s, Savage no longer had much desire to wrestle, likely because of his age, past injuries, and the fact that he probably wasn't hurting for money, that you'd have to pay a lot of money to get him interested in working with you. The fact that he wrestled so few times after 2000 is a sign that his asking price was far too high, even for those money marks companies. McMahon isn't stupid. If he knows your asking price is one you won't budge on, but it's also a number that he doesn't feel is worth paying you, he's not going to keep trying to bring you in. Had Savage's asking price been lower, I'm sure the WWE wouldn't have had a single problem to bring him in for a few matches in the early 2000s.

    Say what you will about McMahon, but he's proven time after time that when it comes to business, he's willing to put aside any past issues if it means making money.
    Interesting. The only questions I had would be why so many previous employers (wrestlers and backstage personnel) also said in Shoot Interviews, that Savage was the one guy VKM didn't want to do business with. I remember someone saying, Savage was brought up on a number of occasions and Vince would say, "I just really don't want to do business with that guy". So maybe that is just folks playing to the rumors for hits and likes?

  6. #2706

    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Cloud Strife View Post
    Interesting. The only questions I had would be why so many previous employers (wrestlers and backstage personnel) also said in Shoot Interviews, that Savage was the one guy VKM didn't want to do business with. I remember someone saying, Savage was brought up on a number of occasions and Vince would say, "I just really don't want to do business with that guy". So maybe that is just folks playing to the rumors for hits and likes?
    Or it just plays into what I said earlier about Savage's asking price being too high. If McMahon knows Savage's asking price is insanely high, he's going to immediately shut down anyone's suggestion to try and work with Savage. McMahon doesn't seem like the type that explains his mindset instead relying on just stating things.

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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    Or it just plays into what I said earlier about Savage's asking price being too high. If McMahon knows Savage's asking price is insanely high, he's going to immediately shut down anyone's suggestion to try and work with Savage. McMahon doesn't seem like the type that explains his mindset instead relying on just stating things.
    I see what you are saying. I do have my doubts that the thing with Stephanie ever happened. If it did, I'm sure VKM would have pushed for charges to be filed since I think she was underage at the time.

  8. #2708

    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Cloud Strife View Post
    I see what you are saying. I do have my doubts that the thing with Stephanie ever happened. If it did, I'm sure VKM would have pushed for charges to be filed since I think she was underage at the time.
    There's zero reason to believe the Stephanie rumors. Like...zero. There's a lot of shitty people in wrestling, including some pieces of shit that actually have raped underage girls, and some of Savage's bad rumors are most likely true, but there's never been any decent reason to believe the Stephanie rumors.

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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    There's zero reason to believe the Stephanie rumors. Like...zero. There's a lot of shitty people in wrestling, including some pieces of shit that actually have raped underage girls, and some of Savage's bad rumors are most likely true, but there's never been any decent reason to believe the Stephanie rumors.

    Who are some of the one's who have raped underage girls? I recall hearing Ring Boy stories involving Patterson and Cowboy Orton's brother (Victim). If you are implying about the Savage/Elizabeth Rumors, yeah I believe that one. Too many folks have said they saw it personally. Between Savage and Luger, she had a rough life man.

  10. #2710

    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Cloud Strife View Post
    Who are some of the one's who have raped underage girls? I recall hearing Ring Boy stories involving Patterson and Cowboy Orton's brother (Victim). If you are implying about the Savage/Elizabeth Rumors, yeah I believe that one. Too many folks have said they saw it personally. Between Savage and Luger, she had a rough life man.
    The biggest pieces of shit would be Grizzly Smith (Jake Roberts' dad), Buck Zumhofe, and Bob Roop are the ones that instantly pop into my head.

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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    The biggest pieces of shit would be Grizzly Smith (Jake Roberts' dad), Buck Zumhofe, and Bob Roop are the ones that instantly pop into my head.

    I remember Jerry Lawler's name being brought up before. I remember a wrestler (can't recall his name but he worked one of the early 1990s Royal Rumbles) made a shoot (worked) during a promo on Lawler at a Memphis show. Basically saying, "Jerry Lawler, you raped a 10 year old girl".

    I'll try to find that promo and send it to you.

  12. #2712

    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Cloud Strife View Post
    I remember Jerry Lawler's name being brought up before. I remember a wrestler (can't recall his name but he worked one of the early 1990s Royal Rumbles) made a shoot (worked) during a promo on Lawler at a Memphis show. Basically saying, "Jerry Lawler, you raped a 10 year old girl".

    I'll try to find that promo and send it to you.
    I mean...that's not the same thing at all. You're talking about a heel promo vs real life allegations and in some cases, like with Zumhofe, real life convictions.

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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Never bought into the Savage-Stephanie rumors either. It just didn't make sense that if that's what Vince's beef was he'd bother doing business w/ Savage or induct him into the HOF.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim
    Uhh, I guess the Graham Brothers simply because they were talked about a very tiny bit in the last 30 years? I can't imagine the average wrestling fan will know shit about any of them other than hearing their names before, if that.
    I was geeked when I read that The Revival mentioned them on RAW a few months ago. Not really surprised that many fans don't know about them b/c WWE hardly ever mentions the Capitol Wrestling Corporation era. Only the historian, history buffs or fans who watched back then know about those teams.


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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    rudeboy riley is pretty bad too dont forget him

    Jim: do you intend to watch or review any of the mid south or mid atlantic shows? i know you dont love reviewing weeklies but at some point big shows are gonna dry up for you

    also say 5 good things about:

    wrestlemania 7
    hornswoggle
    WWE's ECW
    The Truth Commission (this might be the hardest one )
    the dungeon of doom
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  15. #2715

    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hollywood Dook View Post
    do you intend to watch or review any of the mid south or mid atlantic shows? i know you dont love reviewing weeklies but at some point big shows are gonna dry up for you
    I mean, in theory, even when I get done with WWE PPVs, there's still TNA and the indies, but I get what you mean. If you want me to cover either show, you're better off requesting specific episodes. That's far easier to do than striving to cover a succession of episodes.

    also say 5 good things about:
    wrestlemania 7

    - Best emotional moment in WM history with Elizabeth and Savage reuniting.

    - Savage/Warrior is also maybe the WWE MOTY.

    - It's certainly has some random historic notes due to Taker's first match.

    - The Hart Foundation dragged The Nasty Boys to a super rare good match.

    - I'm a mark for the LA Sports Arena.

    hornswoggle

    - Tbh, I was actually a big Little Bastard fan.

    - He served his role well, even if he wasn't meant for the smarks.

    - Had some shocking longevity for a midget in the WWE.

    - Figured out how to make various gimmicks work.

    - Biggest midget star in WWE history?

    WWE's ECW

    - Initially, I thought it was actually nice that they made the program look different from Raw and Smackdown.

    - In the last couple of years, it was the best WWE program.

    - Christian's ECW Title reign is one of the best WWE title reigns of that decade.

    - It was a nice platform to debut Punk without worrying he'd be buried on Raw or Smackdown.

    - After a rough first six months, they slowly found their identity.

    The Truth Commission (this might be the hardest one )

    - The very end of the group had a revamped Kurrgan as a total monster and it was great.

    - The Jackyl was a good manager, even if he didn't get much of a chance to stand out.

    - I had the Kurrgan/Recon 2 pack action figure set back when I was a kid. That's uh...kinda cool?

    - You can't say they overstayed their welcome. If you stopped watching the WWE for a few months, you pretty much missed the entire run.

    - Ultimately, can you even say it was a bad group? The WWE didn't put any effort into the faction, give them a push, or have them be anything other than filler. I'd rather bitch about a lame group like DOA rather than an unit that didn't get a chance to actively suck.

    the dungeon of doom

    - If nothing else, it made sense to give the faction a try. It worked so well for Hogan in the mid 80s.

    - It gave John Tenta something to do, which is never a bad thing.

    - At least when they were bad, they were so bad that it was sorta entertaining.

    - The Sullivan/Benoit program produced some great matches including a WCW MOTYC for 1996.

    - It allowed Jimmy Hart to become a heel again, making up for the mistake of allowing him to be a babyface for a couple of years.

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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    The one thing I liked about the Dungeon of Doom, besides the fact they were so bad it was hilarious, was the nWo angle kicked off right at the perfect time to prove that they were right about Hulkamania all along and Hollywood Hogan kicked off his nWo run by taking the belt back from The Giant and Dungeon.

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  17. #2717

    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostface View Post
    The one thing I liked about the Dungeon of Doom, besides the fact they were so bad it was hilarious, was the nWo angle kicked off right at the perfect time to prove that they were right about Hulkamania all along and Hollywood Hogan kicked off his nWo run by taking the belt back from The Giant and Dungeon.
    I wasn't a fan of that.

    Going into that Hog Wild main event, how were we supposed to really care? It was heel vs heel, and even though Hogan was the bigger heel since he was anti-WCW, how are we supposed to back The Giant when he's been a heel since his arrival? Not only did this take away from Hogan's ability to get heel heat by defeating a babyface, it made The Giant's monster title reign a bit pointless since the natural conclusion was for a babyface to eventually conquer him. WCW did the same thing a few months later by having The Outsiders beat fellow heels, Harlem Heat, to win the WCW Tag Titles. Who gives a fuck? The Outsiders absolutely should have just beaten Sting and Lex Luger for the titles instead. They even did this yet again with Syxx beating heel Dean Malenko to win the Cruiserweight Title.

    The nWo in general just sucked and even from the beginning with these initial title switches, the booking didn't make the most sense.

    Where I do think the transistion between The Dungeon of Doom as the #1 heel faction to the nWo taking over is interesting is that with the Dungeon, you had a group that was not cool at all and felt extremely dated. Meanwhile, the nWo had the cool factor and felt like something you hadn't seen on US TV ever before.

  18. #2718
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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    I had the Kurrgan/Recon 2 pack action figure set back when I was a kid. That's uh...kinda cool?
    I had that too. They were constantly jobbing out to my Legion of Doom 2 pack though.
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    Spoiler:


  19. #2719

    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Spanish Nicky View Post
    I had that too. They were constantly jobbing out to my Legion of Doom 2 pack though.
    Looking at the packing, apparently The Truth Commission were such jobbers that they didn't even bother spelling Recon's name correctly.



    Some of these faction based two-packs came off as super random to me in terms of how they'd select which two would get a figure. For the Truth Commission, I can understand why they went with Kurrgan, but why Recon and not Sniper? Then there's the Nation of Domination two-pack:

    Spoiler:



    I can understand not going for The Rock since he'd have plenty of figures himself, but why not pair the actual team of D-Lo and Mark Henry?


    or even the DOA faction:

    Spoiler:



    As a kid, I can remember appreciating the fact that Chainz was one of the figures since you can always pretend the other is Skull or 8-Ball, but even then, I was confused as to how they decided on 8-Ball and not Skull. But wait...it gets even weirder!

    Skull did eventually get himself a figure:

    Spoiler:



    but...8 Ball got 2 additional figures:

    Spoiler:



    So how exactly did the WWE decide on giving 8 Ball a bunch more figures than his own twin brother?

  20. #2720
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    Re: The Ask Jim Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    Looking at the packing, apparently The Truth Commission were such jobbers that they didn't even bother spelling Recon's name correctly.



    Some of these faction based two-packs came off as super random to me in terms of how they'd select which two would get a figure. For the Truth Commission, I can understand why they went with Kurrgan, but why Recon and not Sniper? Then there's the Nation of Domination two-pack:

    Spoiler:



    I can understand not going for The Rock since he'd have plenty of figures himself, but why not pair the actual team of D-Lo and Mark Henry?


    or even the DOA faction:

    Spoiler:



    As a kid, I can remember appreciating the fact that Chainz was one of the figures since you can always pretend the other is Skull or 8-Ball, but even then, I was confused as to how they decided on 8-Ball and not Skull. But wait...it gets even weirder!

    Skull did eventually get himself a figure:

    Spoiler:



    but...8 Ball got 2 additional figures:

    Spoiler:



    So how exactly did the WWE decide on giving 8 Ball a bunch more figures than his own twin brother?
    Apparently they thought Recon was Mad Dog Vachon as well


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