[The Phantom]

Robinson; Sackey, Tait, Catt, Lewsey; Wilkinson, Gomarsall - Englands Backline last night…. Take out Catt and that is a quality backline, full of creativity (catt is just passed his sell by date). Robinson Sackey and Lewsey are 3 pacey individuals, who you’d back one on one with almost anyone. Tait has impressed be a lot this world cup. It just seems to me that Engand have no faith in their backline. The game against Wales they spread the ball out once, and scored a magnificent try. If that was a Welsh backline I’d be very proud. The All Blacks backline is not even that good compared to previous seasons. Their centres are suspect, and they need to have a definitive full back. Swapping Mealamu and McAllister all the time has not helped them at all.

It just really kills me to see this happening again. I’m not even switching on the TV this week, because the media is so over the top.

I wouldn’t expect you to appologise for the way England got to the final, and nor you should. I wouldn’t if it was Wales, but England will have a major problem from now on. This campaign will be hailed a success, and quite rightfully so, but there is no development in the game (to me anyway). By reaching the final it merely papers over the cracks. The RFU will go away happy, but if they don’t change things soon, England will be in a mess playing wise. Ashton will probably stay on for another 2 years or so.. which means England will be waaay behind the other nations in as far as development is concerned. Wales, France, Australia, New Zealand, Argentina, South Africa will all have new coaches (Ireland should do to, but they won’t because they made the error of signing O’Sullivan before the World Cup) and structures in place, to make sure what happened this year does not happen again in 2011. Also the English game is run by mulit millionaires who don’t give a damn about developing players for the future.. as is evident with the amount of foreigners in the league, and we’ll see a lot of this now with the mass exodus of All Black players to Europe. At least in France they all go to the 2nd division to play.

England beat Australia because Australia didn’t have a pack, which in the modern game quite frankly baffles me. John Connolly is a forwards man himself, so I’m sure there is no man more embarrassed than himself.

New Zealand went out because they didn’t play their own game. Some will say France stopped them, to a certain degree that is true, but some of the blame must be put on the players themselves, from watching a lot of their games over the last 4 years, they weren’t putting themselves in the positions they normally do. Also the MAJOR factor in why New Zealand didn’t win, is because they don’t know how to finish close games off. They are never in the position of having to do so. Most close games they are involved in, they lose. Just look at their Tri-Nations battles with Australia. They should have won the game with a drop goal in the closing mins, but instead they looked for the try.

From what I’ve seen of South Africa (and to be honest, it’s not an awful lot) they are not a team who will be bullied up front, and they have the ability to finish off close games, having had many (if not all) of their players playing the Heiniken Cup, and the Curry Cup regularly.

4 years ago I was actually sick when England won the world cup (might have had something to do with me being out until the early hours the previous night celebrating my 18th birthday… but still), I will probably be puking again if they life the Webb Ellis cup again next Saturday. I might even take a long holiday, and never return?!

Do you think I feel strongly about this?

[Tyler Durden]

Taking each of Deadly's points, my response in red -

Robinson; Sackey, Tait, Catt, Lewsey; Wilkinson, Gomarsall - Englands Backline last night…. Take out Catt and that is a quality backline, full of creativity (catt is just passed his sell by date). Robinson Sackey and Lewsey are 3 pacey individuals, who you’d back one on one with almost anyone. Tait has impressed be a lot this world cup. It just seems to me that Engand have no faith in their backline. The game against Wales they spread the ball out once, and scored a magnificent try. If that was a Welsh backline I’d be very proud. The All Blacks backline is not even that good compared to previous seasons. Their centres are suspect, and they need to have a definitive full back. Swapping Mealamu and McAllister all the time has not helped them at all.

Comparing the all Black backline with ours (which contains two guys, possibly three that are over 33 and playing their last competitive matches more than likely, a wing with just 9 caps and a 21 year old rookey is frankly ridiculous and no way were you or anyone with a sane mind comparing this backline favourably with the All Blacks a few weeks ago. Suddenly because we're winning again it's the usual whining all round the world and telling us "why don't you just throw it around... you know.....so we can beat you like we've all been doing the last four years". It's an opinion that has been well ignored (rightly as it's been proven) by management and players

It just really kills me to see this happening again. I’m not even switching on the TV this week, because the media is so over the top.

You can slam the media, but England's fans have been extremely low key throughout this and are just enjoying the success now after four years of rubbish. You can't tell me that the media in Wales (just look at the vitriol spitting out of your own land in 2005 following the 6 Nations) or any other country wouldn't be completely over the top if their country had come from 36-0 defeat a month ago to the World Cup Final. It's ridiculous, unheralded and something no other country has ever achieved before.

I wouldn’t expect you to appologise for the way England got to the final, and nor you should. I wouldn’t if it was Wales, but England will have a major problem from now on. This campaign will be hailed a success, and quite rightfully so, but there is no development in the game (to me anyway). By reaching the final it merely papers over the cracks. The RFU will go away happy, but if they don’t change things soon, England will be in a mess playing wise.

I agree here, we have by and large had to fall back on players like Regan, Shaw, Gomarsall, Moody etc who were not good enough for the team 4 years ago, and won't be around again in another 4 years. The RFU certainly shouldn't accept this as some kind of celebration of how they've acted (alongside the Guiness Premiership) over the last 4 years. Hopefully they've learned their lesson....we'll see

Ashton will probably stay on for another 2 years or so.. which means England will be waaay behind the other nations in as far as development is concerned. Wales, France, Australia, New Zealand, Argentina, South Africa will all have new coaches (Ireland should do to, but they won’t because they made the error of signing O’Sullivan before the World Cup) and structures in place, to make sure what happened this year does not happen again in 2011.

I don't know what you're point is here. Changing a coach doesn't necessarily bring any success (as we found out the 1st time we changed). Pretty much all those countries you named (apart from France) changed coaches from the last World Cup and most did worse this time around. New Zealand spent more money than ever before on "structure" and "committees" and all sorts of sports psychologists and masseurs and pampered their players to the hilt. In World Cup terms that amounted to their worst ever showing.

Also the English game is run by mulit millionaires who don’t give a damn about developing players for the future.. as is evident with the amount of foreigners in the league, and we’ll see a lot of this now with the mass exodus of All Black players to Europe. At least in France they all go to the 2nd division to play.

I agree. Lessons will hopefully be learned.

England beat Australia because Australia didn’t have a pack, which in the modern game quite frankly baffles me. John Connolly is a forwards man himself, so I’m sure there is no man more embarrassed than himself.

That's right. We had a huge advantage in that area and milked it.

New Zealand went out because they didn’t play their own game. Some will say France stopped them, to a certain degree that is true, but some of the blame must be put on the players themselves, from watching a lot of their games over the last 4 years, they weren’t putting themselves in the positions they normally do. Also the MAJOR factor in why New Zealand didn’t win, is because they don’t know how to finish close games off. They are never in the position of having to do so. Most close games they are involved in, they lose. Just look at their Tri-Nations battles with Australia. They should have won the game with a drop goal in the closing mins, but instead they looked for the try.

Agree on most points here. New Zealand were doing some crazy drop outs at 13-3 up from their own 22. Their problem seems to be partly arrogance, partly a lack of competitive/tight games, partly maybe a fear of failure in this tournament which is biting with them more and more every time a tourno comes and goes

From what I’ve seen of South Africa (and to be honest, it’s not an awful lot) they are not a team who will be bullied up front, and they have the ability to finish off close games, having had many (if not all) of their players playing the Heiniken Cup, and the Curry Cup regularly.

Agreed. If they get past Argentina they will be favourites for the final

4 years ago I was actually sick when England won the world cup (might have had something to do with me being out until the early hours the previous night celebrating my 18th birthday… but still), I will probably be puking again if they life the Webb Ellis cup again next Saturday. I might even take a long holiday, and never return?!

Do you think I feel strongly about this?

Yes. You clearly need counselling from one of those now unemployed New Zealand sports psychologists.

[The Phantom]

Well at least I got a few agreeable points!

How are England going to beat South Africa next weekend? I really haven't seen enough of their play to really comment on how the Springbok will play the game. The only games i've seen was their 2nd string side vs. Tonga, and the QF vs. Fiji.

The thing I was getting at with the coach, is that a coach needs at least 3 years to settle a side and get his own stamp on the side of how they are going to play. You're right, NZ and Australia went out early, but Henry, Hanson and Smith had them playing a brand of rugby for 4 years which was almost perfect. With Connolly, he came in 2 years ago, and sorted out a side which looked a shambles at the end of Eddie Jones' tenure. And last time round you made the mistake of promoting from with in... I am not a huge fan of that in rugby. If he wasn't good enough to be the main man in the first place then why appoint him now? Dean Richards should be the next England coach.

I'm off to book an appointment for a Kiwi sports psychologist!

[hamihaha]

What a pity France lost against England.
Both played well....

[Tyler Durden]

Firstly, well done South Africa. They are an incredible side, so very very few weaknesses in it. Their defence and their line out are truly awesome, as good as any sides that there has been and that in itself gave them the armoury to build pressure on us.

I'm disappointed that we conceded three silly penalties, the decision to run from our 22 which led to Tait falling, Kay's deliberate block and Moody's trip all, added to JW missing a very good chance at a drop goal, up to enough points for us to have won today, but having said that.....that's part and parcel of the game, you make mistakes and you lose. That and our inability to merge both the power side of the game with the creative, did for us in the end.

We are a pretty ruthless bunch as has been witnessed over the last month, but South Africa are just even more ruthless! Their all round game was the best of all the teams over this tournament so they fully deserve the crown.

Smit, Matfield, Smith, Roussow and Fourie were at the top of their games.

For us this has been a fantastic tournament and, overall, it was a very good one to watch.

Finally, very few of the "whipping boys" looked out of their depth over in France and hopefully the IRB take this on board when arranging future tournaments/tours.

[The Phantom]

A tremendous World Cup. I also hope the so called minnows will be involved in the 2011 RWC in New Zealand. After all they did tender to stage the competition involving 20 teams. Let’s just hope the infrastructure will be able to cope with all these people going down under.

Here’s my Team of the tournament…

15. Ignacio Corleto (Argentina)
14. Vilimoni Delasau (Fiji)
13. Seru Rabeni (Fiji)
12. Felipe Contepomi (Argentina)
11. Bryan Habana (South Africa)
10. Juan Martin Hernandez (Argentina)
09. Fourie Du Preez (South Africa)

01. Andrew Sherriden (England)
02. John Smit (South Africa)
03. Matt Stevens (England)
04. Bakkies Botha (South Africa)
05. Victor Matfield (South Africa)
06. Jerry Collins (New Zealand)
07. Juan Martin Fernandez Lobbe (Argentina)
08. Julien Bonnaire (France)

Now if you asked me to pick what I thought would have been the team of the tournament before hand, it'd been a lot different from that one! Many of the Worlds Best players didn't quite turn up for this World Cup. I blame that on the rotation policies coaches use these days.

And here's some other "awards"

Team of the tournament: Argentina

Try of the tournament: Endo (Japan vs. Wales) A wonderful length of the field try starting on their own try line crossing the entire width and length of the pitch to end in the opposite corner. Towards the end of the play even us Welsh fans in the stadium were willing them to score! Probably the best try I’ve ever seen in person.

Game of the Tournament: Wales vs. Fiji – It had all the drama, tries, attacking flair, heartache… everything! And it meant our useless coach got the boot.

[Tyler Durden]

I'd go with most of those choices, just with a few changes -

15. Jason Robinson (England)
14. Vilimoni Delasau (Fiji)
13. Seru Rabeni (Fiji)
12. Felipe Contepomi (Argentina)
11. Bryan Habana (South Africa)
10. Juan Martin Hernandez (Argentina)
09. Fourie Du Preez (South Africa)

01. Andrew Sheridan (England)
02. John Smit (South Africa)
03. Carl Hayman (New Zealand)
04. Simon Shaw (England)
05. Victor Matfield (South Africa)
06. Juan Smith (South Africa) - I can go for him at 6, he interchanges!
07. Thiery Dusautoir (France)
08. Julien Bonnaire (France)

[The Phantom]

The guys you had in your team, weren't far off my team, with the exeption of Robinson.